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what an awful character
So you mean having a entire trilogy to himself, reuniting the Empire, almost destroying the New Republic, beating Admiral Ackbar, countering and besting Luke Skywalker, to be lame?
Bro
This Thrawn got beat by a bunch of Space worms and a Teenager and you're saying Legends Thrawn is garbage?
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How about the fact that the purgill were only seen in ONE filler episode three seasons ago, and have not been seen or even mentioned since? That part where they head off in the Ghost to find the purgill was so random and forced and lazily written... it does not serve as adequate reason for the purgill to show up.
The wolves are a different story; they've been present all throughout Season 4, so it came as no surprise when they played a hand in helping the Rebels capture Governor Pryce... but the whales aren't even native to Lothal, and like I just said, they've only ever made one appearance in the show before now, and have never been significant to the plot until the last 5 minutes of the series. That. Is. Ridiculous.
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They did a twist simply for the sake of doing a twist. They brought in the Purgil just like TLJ killed Snoke, to shock first time viewers. But unfortunately by doing so they have condemnd subsequent viewings to show quite clearly how weak the writing for that area was and is
Replace the Purgil with something like Galactus and the effect would still be the same. The only difference is that the Purgil appeared in a SINGLE episode all the way back in Season 2 and haven't been mentioned since
So if you didn't manage to see that Episode you're practically at a loss for the whole thing
It was a incredibly rushed plot-line, with no foreshadow, no prior groundwork, just bad writing
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How is that episode "filler" considering the fact they were made significant by appearing in the final episode? That episode also further exemplified Ezra's connection to the creatures of the galaxy like I mentioned before. Therefor that episode wasn't filler, clearly. Your argument doesn't really make sense.
Filoni has always said no episode should be perceived as fillers and there is a reason for everything. He's kept true on that. The whole theme of the final 2 episodes was "calling in every single favor they had" (it was literally in the episode description somewhere in my channel guide) which was both animals and characters from the entire series, some we also have not seen for awhile or aside from a few episodes.
Saying they aren't native to Lothal is quite ridiculous, too. They can go into hyperspace, they obviously travel far distances. It's no different then whales in real life when the OCEAN is their home. Whales migrate far and wide which was obviously the inspiration for the Purgill.
Where exactly did I say Legends Thrawn is garbage? I said his death was cheesy, and it was. It was a typical EU "Well I guess we should just cut this off now. Let the good guys win!" ending. He never saw it coming same as here in Rebels. Only this time, he's not likely dead so his story will continue.
And he didn't have an entire trilogy to himself. It was the first books in the EU, so at best he split time with Luke, Han, and Leia. Mara Jade, the Nogri, and others were introduced as well.
I was thinking the same thing. I'm not sure the purgill are actually native to anywhere, they seem to just "swim" through space everywhere.
Characters died on the show. There was seventh sister and eighth brother (I think those are the right names), Minister Tua, and Governor Pryce off the top of my head. Oh, yea, and there was Kanan Jarrus, only one of the main characters. I'm actually glad there wasn't a lot of deaths. They kill people off when the story calls for it, not for a wow factor.
It had absolutely no relevance to the main plot for Season 2, Season 3, or Season 4. The purgill being shoehorned into the final battle in the last 5 minutes of the series does not make it any less of a filler, it just means the writers were being lazy.
I was comparing them to the Loth Wolves; it made sense for them to answer Ezra's call, as they appear to be the spiritual guardians of the planet, and have been central to the plot of Season 4. But as I've said time and time again, the Purgill had no relevance to Lothal or the main plot, they were dropped in at the last minute with little to no explanation or reasoning for them being there.
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Notice how a good amount of those were imperials.
The problem with constantly killing imperials is that it makes it seem like the Rebels are really causing a setback to the Empire, when in fact the first major victory is supposed to be at Scarif. It degrades the Empire as a threat in the show, and makes it hard for the audience to care about the struggle the Rebels face.
I don't think the movies even had us see that many Star Destroyers get crippled, yet in Rebels we see it happen multiple times per season.
Not to mention how they canonized Stormtroopers being terrible shots in this show, when in the Original Trilogy Obi-Wan said that they were actually very precise.
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Sadly, this is all true. Also, the pig should've died. How is it that Gregor gets shot in the chest and dies, but the pig gets shot in the exact same spot and gets right back up like it was nothing!?!
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It's a TVY7 show lol No they aren't going to show a lot of death on screen. And why does that even matter? Clone Wars wasn't a great show because they killed people or showed it more. It was a great show because of the stories they told and plot lines they wove together. The irony is it's the exact opposite of mature to pretend otherwise or that on screen death makes a show. lol
And on the subject of death, they ended this finale blowing up an Imperial center full of Imperials. We consistently saw Rebel fighters get shot, blown up in their fighters, or Rebel ships blown up. They lost hundreds of Rebels lives to Thrawn at Attolon including Commander Sato and his carrier. Clan Wren got fried by Sabine's weapon. Gregor got shot on screen. For a TV Y7 show, there was a ton of death in Rebels.
Would Star Wars be better off if we got nothing instead of Rebels? Absolutely NOT lol And that's the part that makes even less sense. I don't know how to pretend Rebels shouldn't have happened.
If nothing else, Rebels continued the stories of fan favorite characters from Clone Wars, showed us the buildup of the Rebel Alliance, and provided a mechanism to get Thrawn back into canon in a more lasting way than the EU books. Along the way we got some seriously memorable moments.
Yeah it's definitely not filler. They've been building up Ezra's ability to connect with nature and people around him since season 1. Remember he used those creatures against the Grand Inquisitor and his forces at that base? It also reminds me a bit of the Avatar movie. The Empire brutally strip mined worlds and completely ruined them in the process. That's why the wolves sought out Ezra and Kanan. As Ezra said, they are on Lothal's side, and that put them against the Empire.
Did I see it coming? No. But honestly, there was no alternative here. The Rebellion had nothing that could knock Thrawn out of Lothal, and neither Thrawn or Ezra can be around for the OT. And on a technical level, the battle scene looks outstanding.
Yes, it was. It had absolutely no relevance to the main plot of up until the last 5 minutes of the series, and the Purgill did not appear nor were they mentioned in the show until those last few minutes of the finale, a moment that was so blatantly forced and badly-written it's embarrassing.
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Episode 15 of Season 2 "The Call". The mining guild was mining a purgil feeding ground. Ezra connected with the purgil, they helped take down the mining guild, and even saved Ezra's life.
Ezra has been connecting like this with creatures since episode 9 in Season 1 "Gathering Forces", when he connected with the fyrnocks at Fort Anaxes and had them attack the Grand Inquisitor and his Stormtroopers.
Not a single bit of this has been blatantly forced.
No matter how you rephrase your argument, there is no getting around the fact that the Purgill's presence in the finale was absolutely forced. I'm gonna say it one last time; They. Only Appeared. In. ONE. Episode. They have not appeared or been mentioned since that episode. There were no allusions to their return in the finale.
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Can you at least pretend to have watched the show before ranting on it? lol
Scarif is still the first time the Rebellion won a major engagement with the Empire. The Rebellion was not a part of this victory at Lothal. The Ghost crew even says as much at the end of the episode. After Thrawn destroyed their fleet at Attolon, Mon Mothma refused to send more than an X-wing squadron to try to bomb the Tie Defender factory. That failed too.
Luke is still the last hope, not for the Jedi Order, but against Vader and the Emperor. He's still the last known Jedi because Ezra was not knighted a Jedi like Kanan. And now we know Ezra never returned during the OT, and no one knows where he is.
Very true. I hate how the Empire is portrayed as being woefully incompetent in the show; the only villains that ever pose a serious threat to the Rebels are Darth Vader in Season 2, and Grand Admiral Thrawn in Season 3.
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Ok, how about this. If Ezra used the purgill constantly throughout the series, then Thrawn could come up with something to counteract them. But instead, he used them at the end of the standoff at Lothal as an ace in the hole to get rid of Thrawn. This is logical, right?
it's literally the princess calling the birds and heck to clean the house
Ezra is like Disney princess!
How was it cheesy?
He lost the same way Palpatine and Tarkin did. They did everything right but that one teeny tiny lapse in judgment I.E: Not suspecting that all of the Noghri learned that the Empire had been lying to him and that they had allied with the Skywalkers due to Darth Vader
And was stabbed in the back by Rukh his trusted Bodyguard. I thought that was a pretty great ending to his character. True, it would have been great if Thrawn had been able to appear in additional novels but I think his departure fits well since it was simply a Trilogy
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That’s debatable. But either way, it didn’t show the oppressive nature of the Empire exactly, because honestly, anyone could’ve avoided the Stormtroopers. The show is way too biased on the Rebellion side, and just is overall just shows too much of the Empire’s incompetence, and that begs the question, how did it stand so long if this was it’s army?
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That Specialist rework was disappointing.
A full squad
Failed to hit
If the Empire was truly this incompetent it would never have taken over it would have lasted 5 years at best
1980s Transformers Decepticons are far more threatening and powerful enemies then the whole of the Empire introduced in Rebels. They actually hit their targets and beat the protagonists once in a while
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Exactly. The Empire in this show would only have Darth Vader to help them, and It would’ve lasted until someone said I’m tired of this and went to the throne room.
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That Specialist rework was disappointing.
The whole Noghri plot was weak from the start. Then they start calling Leia "Lady Vader" and start pledging loyalty to her. lol Thrawn's fleet was dismantling the New Republic fleet, Ruhk all the sudden stabs him in the back, and then of course the Imperial threat instantly evaporates. If nothing else, Pallaeon was easily competent enough to hold the battle together.
That's how the EU did nearly every major story until the New Jedi Order. There was some kind of "space whale" scenario every single time. That's the irony with the complaints about how Rebels ended lol
Like I said, at least with Rebels we know Thrawn is still alive, and it's likely this leads to stories or a TV show in the Unknown Regions and Chiss space.
So exactly when did Stormtroopers in the OT ever hit anything? Maybe you guys were watching a different trilogy. I remember them consistently missing Luke, Leia, Han, and Chewy at point blank range. Han runs into an entire hangar full of Stormtroopers, they fill the hall with blaster fire, and he runs back around the corner without a scratch. lol
Then there's the crack shooting on display at Bespin. Point blank they couldn't hit R2 or even Chewy plodding along with 3PO strapped to his back lol
Don't forget the legion of the Emperor's best troops that got owned by the Ewoks lol
Seriously, Rebels didn't need to water them down. In fact, they made fun of Stormtroopers when Rex put on Stormtrooper armor in Season 2 and started missing lol. Kanan was like, "So you do shoot like a Stormtrooper" lol
Tantive IV. They couldn't hit the protagonists simply because of plot armor. They honestly make it seem like the Empire is a bunch of pushovers though. Completely incompetent.
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That Specialist rework was disappointing.
What are you talking about? The Stormtroopers on the Tantive IV were pretty good shots, they killed several Rebel soldiers in that scene.
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Replying to Arch-Angel because he said when did the Stormtroopers ever hit anything. So I gave the example and just said that due to plot armor, they couldn't hit any of the protagonists such as Han, Leia, and Chewie.
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That Specialist rework was disappointing.
And see how long it lasts. There are Historical mirrors on Earth, just look at the fall of Alexander The Great's Empire
There's a difference between a well-timed assassination shattering morale and resolve in a Fleet mainly held together by the charisma and intelligence of their Leader and a random "Space Animals save the day by flying through Star Destroyers like rusty tin cans!"
Yes, you can say most of the EU stories had the same outcome over and over again and I suppose that can apply to a large majority of Cinema and Literature but the key difference is at least those were better written then this finale
I've been through the "New Canon is better because old was dumb and had too much power" propaganda and spat it out myself. I'm never going back to agreeing with that statement
Yes, and now Thrawn gets thrown into a terrible storyline. Rather then ending his story with a great OT battle he gets thrown into the cesspool of the ST Era where he'll probably meet his end in the Unknown Regions with a anticlimactic battle
And we'll always know that he got beaten by the power of Space animals
Brilliant decision
Totally wouldn't prefer the old ending at all!
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They were actually winning before their AT-STs got commandeered
Yes, let's not try and right some mistakes especially since we are using animation. Let's just make the Empire incompetent and stupid and make them incapable of hitting a floating target 5 feet away from their faces because. "Lol, Imperials are already incompetent, lol, lol, XD, I'm so funny"
Making a Enemy absolutely incompetent isn't enjoyable (Unless, we're talking about 1980s Transformers, even they won a little at times) it doesn't make things intense, it doesn't result in in tension, it doesn't result in anything interesting. It simply results in the death of writing and also helps makes your protagonists incompetent as well for not taking advantage of their enemy's incompetence
All they had to do was simply copy the British Army during the Revolutionary War. Which is not only a nigh perfect near contemporary event, but a great event to base your fictional war on
The British Army was a powerful and very, very, credible threat that had won wars and ruled for hundreds of years at that point. Their main failures in the war and the reason for their defeat was their taxation and growing control ignited a few brave people to rise up against them, put Commanders that were only there because of relation to powerful houses, inexperienced commanders, hiring Foreign armies and powers that had no allegiance to them but to coin, and of course facing a guerrilla army using guerrilla tactics which is something that has troubled and grieved Armies since the dawn of Civilization
If you look at Star Wars especially the OT Era. I see far more similarity to colonial America and Imperial England then I see in WW2 Bounty Hunters after all fit quite well as the Hessians
And in-universe this perspective fits quite well. Either way you look at it since the Clone Wars were a large scale open conflict with the two powers quite front and center
So obviously a large amount of military education would have been spent on Large Scale conflicts not on Hit And Run, small scale guerrilla warfare. And in the OT the Imperials were competent they simply had unfamiliarity with the ingenuity Rebels could come up with
Like when Han attached the Falcon to the back of Captain Needa's Star Destroyer. Captain Needa went through a list of scenarios and explanations for the Falcon's disappearance he was simply unfamiliar with the kinds of tactics Rebels could do
And that's why Boba was successful in tracking them down because that's his field of work he deals with these kinds of tactics all the time. It's not that he was necessarily smarter then Needa nor was Needa necessarily smarter then Boba
Boba and Needa had the same level of experience in different fields
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literally everyone you said besides kanan can be explained by "they died because they were the bad guys"
Trying to say this is a Rebels thing ignores what went on through the whole OT.
Thrawn was assissinated during a battle on his on ship. How is anyone else going to know? Am I really supposed to believe Pallaeon can't take command and hold a battle together they were already on their way to winning? lol It's worse than Endor because there at least the Imperial forces had to witness the Executor go down, then the Death Star blow up.
As good as the EU could be, this was a constant theme and complaint about those books. Overwhelming Imperial odds somehow magically evaporate or are swept aside by unforeseen events. Did you read Darksaber? Some Jedi kid knocks an entire fleet of Star Destroyers out of orbit before the Darksaber shows up lol
I'm not in any way saying current canon is better, at least not post ROTJ. Aftermath is terrible and the ST is a disappointment. I'm just saying it's specifically better for Thrawn. What if the next TV series is now set in the Unknown Regions and Chiss space? We'll get to see him operate on his own turf against whatever evil he thinks the Empire was supposed to help with.
And speaking of ST, I just had a cool thought. What if the Chiss are the Republic's allies? What if Ezra, Sabine, and Ahsoka return in Episode IX with a Chiss fleet along with maybe Mandalorian support? Ezra would be Luke and Leia's age, and Ahsoka would still be around. Then they help Rey against Kylo Ren and his Knights of Ren. The Chiss and Mandalorians beat the First Order fleet. The Republic is restored. Ahsoka and Ezra help Rey re-establish the Jedi Order. Maybe Ezra and Sabine are married at this point and have a couple of twenty-something Jedi kids too lol
By pushing Ezra, Sabine, Thrawn, and Ahsoka out to the Unknown Regions, they have opened up some really cool possibilities.
the storm troopers were under orders by darth vader to let them go because he wanted to deal with them personally.
Stormtroopers are actually good soldiers, who follow orders. (unlike a certain clone trooper but i digress) they can be seen at the beginning of ANH wrecking the rebels, in ESB kicking butt on hoth, and in RO killing baze, chirrut and K2S0, who are all named characters. Rebels throws this out the window and makes it some kind of joke because of their god awful writing showing the rebels kicking the empire so hard that it's hard to see any tension. why is the empire controlling the galaxy if the rebels named characters can just heck smack them into oblivion?
They weren't under orders through the entire trilogy lol. Only maybe on the Death Star. After that, Luke was all Vader cared about. He gave up Han and the others.
I'm not gonna go into a lot of details but I will say that I do not quite agree with your opinion either.
I have seen every single episode of Clone Wars and Rebels and while I agree that they were watered down a bit so that kids could watch them more that doesn't make them bad either including the finale.
As for the finale it was not bad but I agree that it wasn't as good as it could have been.
For the finale I knew it would have to be about them outsmarting Thrawn and destroying Imperial forces on Lothal but I also feel that they way it happened was not nearly as Epic as it should have been considering this was supposed to be the series finale.
I was picturing a huge battle between Rebel and Imperial fleets and in a way the actual events of the finale could have fit with this one as well.
Would start as a huge battle between the fleets in orbit while the Rebels try to hold off a lot of Stormtroopers on the ground and when all hope seems lost is when those Purragil and Wolves would shop up and save the day.
Yes its not totally different from what actually happened but if the Space and Ground Battles for that episode were much larger (not quite as large as Scariff) it would have worked out much better than it did.
So in conclusion I didn't love the finale as much as I could have but I didn't really hate it either. I just think there should have been a lot more STAR WARS so that it would feel like a proper series finale for a STAR WARS show!
I am still fighting with the wolve arcs. Kanan recently died. I more liked the previous seasons.
Side note: Sabine's hair looks much better.
Don't worry, it only gets worse from here
Pirate of the Knights of Gareth
Yay, I watch the episode with Ahsoka a few minutes ago. I am so happy that she is back
ANH didn't bring back obi wan, he died and stayed dead.
i would have preferred if ashoka actually died then came back as a force ghost for some heck all reason
i mean they are already ruining the force with this furry wolf heck so it doesn't matter anymore.
At first I also kind of wanted Ahsoka to stay dead. I would love to see more of her character, but her original death was so well done. But then Ezra and her talked about how neither of them could save their master, and that kind of parallel is way to meaningful for Ezra for the writers to pass up.
I'm interested to see her character now that she's moved on from Anakin. Hopefully she's in the next tv show