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Frostbite engine, too unstable it's future is

TheStalker88
6084 posts Member
edited April 2018
I've been reading things on the forums and reddit and people keep bringing up how unstable and glitchy things can become with Frostbite. From lag, to glitches the engine has a hard time to keep everything in check because all these ultra immersive graphics eat away at the resources and precious memory, thus bugs and glitches are always coming up as a result of never ending optimazations that just can't never be fully successful. The time where great graphics and great performance hasn't arrived yet. Maybe with next gen quantum computing and other tech advancements things will get better.

Replies

  • t3hBar0n
    5000 posts Member
    My game runs well, and I have a core I5 from like 5 years ago with a gtx1080 and 32 gigs ram with SSD...

  • TheStalker88
    6084 posts Member
    edited April 2018
    Sure it does but that's just rendering mostly. Im talking lag, hit detection and other things that can fluctuate from time to time. Like Palpatine's lightning, one time it does good damage while at other times it lags and doesn't do enough damage while the game runs smoothly.
  • he's gonna require some statistical data to back these statements up, otherwise it's just useless emotional responses
  • Not only that but why do new patches always create new bugs? Even devs keep saying that their testing environment doesn't mean that the real environment will have the same results. Seems like game's never able to be fully predictable and optimizable
  • You are unfamiliar with sarcasm as well... Makes sense.
  • TheStalker88
    6084 posts Member
    edited April 2018
    The stuff I said about devs defense on the difficulty to patch bugs is true. Testing bugs in their own testing environment is different from real online environment. Devs stated multiple times they have had issues with these things.

    As for what other people said, they made good analysis and summarized common issues across all Frostbite games
  • TheStalker88
    6084 posts Member
    edited April 2018
    Now it doesn't take long to see how great graphics also attracts other issues. You can't simply have both, there's always a payoff for having much of something

    It then kind of make sense how patching stuff can create new bugs and how Soon(TM) they can get patched. Devs, engine, environment, patches, bugs - dark and vicious the cycle is.
    Post edited by TheStalker88 on
  • Frostbite always has, and always will be glitchy, laggy, and worst of all, extremely biased in favor of high ping players. It is a hybrid of server side and client side, only the important decisions like hit detection and player location seem to be made on the client end, which is the totally wrong way to do it.

    Been this way since Battlefield 3. Battlefield 4 was so bad I swore off DICE games for a very long time.
    I put up with this because I like Star Wars and 75% of the time it works ok. Not great but ok.

    I just wish DICE would realize more people have good internet nowadays and should not be punished for it...they need to tone down the lag comp in Frostbite quite a bit...
  • Finally some good insight on the topic. Indeed, time to get on with the times, Dice/EA.
  • moondynemc
    1979 posts Member
    You are unfamiliar with sarcasm as well... Makes sense.

    Reading back, your post didn't seem to imply any sarcasm whatsoever. Keep in mind sarcasm can be hard to get across in text only.
  • And it's not like Battlefront 2 is the ONLY game DICE has with Frostbite as the game engine. Saying it's future is uncertain is like saying my hands could break because I played this one game out of the 4 or 5 I usually do
  • Climenty
    102 posts Member
    I don't know what the Frostbite's future is, but for me this engine is a "no buy" flag now.
  • Long live frostbite!
  • TheStalker88
    6084 posts Member
    edited April 2018
    And it's not like Battlefront 2 is the ONLY game DICE has with Frostbite as the game engine. Saying it's future is uncertain is like saying my hands could break because I played this one game out of the 4 or 5 I usually do

    Yeah, but same issues run alongside all it's games. Frostbite has always had issues as well as server lag and bugs. Just go to Battlefield 1 forums and check out the jam
  • Server lag is very unlikely a side effect of the engine used, I don't know where that idea would even come from.

    Frostbite is a pretty hearty engine, it does lighting and particle effects incredibly well. Some of the games have bugs, but it's not like the games have the same bugs. Every engine has problems and limitations that the developers have to work through or around, the alternative is to create an engine to do exactly what you want it to do, but that means a new engine for every game, or to use a third party engine, which all come with their own limitations and problems.

    Of course that doesn't mean the engine is perfect, but it's not to blame for most of the issues that get blamed on it.
  • Dice definitely needs to take another look at the netcode (can't say it's the EA servers in general as TF2 is pretty good, and I'm sure they both run on EA's DS's) but for what the Frostbite Engine is capable of, it's a damn impressive engine.
  • Dice definitely needs to take another look at the netcode (can't say it's the EA servers in general as TF2 is pretty good, and I'm sure they both run on EA's DS's) but for what the Frostbite Engine is capable of, it's a **** impressive engine.

    Respawn makes incredibly stable games, even the first TF, while light on content ran like an absolute dream. It's good too because with the speed of those games lag would be a nightmare.

    I really look forward to seeing what the SW game they're supposedly working on is like. :)
  • I just said that in another thread, hehe.
  • TheStalker88
    6084 posts Member
    edited April 2018
    Then if netcode is the issue, that's still part of the engine code and the hybrid server and client decisions that are made on the client side these cause issues arise at all times. Just look at how glitchy things get with Palps lighting damage, Idens shield half working and Yodas broken unleash. They've been around and still exist today.
  • Old_fella_1963
    4688 posts Member
    edited April 2018
    ... if they tuned down things the engine had to do graphics/rendering layers wise ( explosions , detail etc etc ) then I am sure the thing that most people want for online shooters , a more level ping playing field, would be better . I feel this is something they could ( even with current engine ) do but that 'sexy' stuff sells the game for the initial money ;-)


    ..soon as I saw the first game play I knew we were in for lag city - Ive probably played less than 50 hours on GA in total solely because I do not have the patience to deal with the lag . SFA is probably even worse, but at least there is flying as a motivator :-) BF2015 small mode desert maps had a simplicity which kept the lag down - so much more enjoyable
  • And it's not like Battlefront 2 is the ONLY game DICE has with Frostbite as the game engine. Saying it's future is uncertain is like saying my hands could break because I played this one game out of the 4 or 5 I usually do

    Yeah, but same issues run alongside all it's games. Frostbite has always had issues as well as server lag and bugs. Just go to Battlefield 1 forums and check out the jam

    That's understandable, but everyone is just doing the same thing as the micro-transactions, it didn't start with BFII, but for some reason everyone thinks it's the worst possible thing only now. Frostbite didn't start now, and this game is not the reason it's like it is. People need to open their eyes and remember there's more to things than just the "here and now"
  • I play on PS4 so don't have a lot of the issues that are on PC but for me Frostbite often really makes me feel like I'm in Star Wars, some things look completely photo-realistic it's phenomenal. For that reason, I never want Dice to lose the contract.
  • TheStalker88
    6084 posts Member
    edited June 2018
    ... if they tuned down things the engine had to do graphics/rendering layers wise ( explosions , detail etc etc ) then I am sure the thing that most people want for online shooters , a more level ping playing field, would be better . I feel this is something they could ( even with current engine ) do but that 'sexy' stuff sells the game for the initial money ;-)


    ..soon as I saw the first game play I knew we were in for lag city - Ive probably played less than 50 hours on GA in total solely because I do not have the patience to deal with the lag . SFA is probably even worse, but at least there is flying as a motivator :-) BF2015 small mode desert maps had a simplicity which kept the lag down - so much more enjoyable

    Yeah that's why not alot of games go for ultra realism. It's not like Dice is the only force on the planet with the ability to render games with such graphics.
  • I've been reading things on the forums and reddit and people keep bringing up how unstable and glitchy things can become with Frostbite. From lag, to glitches the engine has a hard time to keep everything in check because all these ultra immersive graphics eat away at the resources and precious memory, thus bugs and glitches are always coming up as a result of never ending optimazations that just can't never be fully successful. The time where great graphics and great performance hasn't arrived yet. Maybe with next gen quantum computing and other tech advancements things will get better.

    It can be a very glitchy and buggy game engine. It's plus side is that it looks good.
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    Remember the most powerful walk the line between rage and serenity.
  • I play on PS4 so don't have a lot of the issues that are on PC but for me Frostbite often really makes me feel like I'm in Star Wars, some things look completely photo-realistic it's phenomenal. For that reason, I never want Dice to lose the contract.

    I agree, having dice make battlefront is a dream for me. This game is amazing and looks/feels great. If only the launch wasn't tainted by the mtx issue. This is a great successor to the previous generation of battlefront. Even if it's limiting in some ways, it surpassed it in others
  • LeftTurnus
    1099 posts Member
    Yes things look great. But after a while of seeing the same graphics every day, yet getting rubber banding (the only engine that provides this wonderful effect), unreliable hit detection, and many things that only work part time, it gets old. It is time the base mechanics of the engine get some tweaking.

    The other thing about game engines, as it is out longer, and gets used often, there should be improvements to it gameplay wise. Instead the graphics got the attention and the mechanics went backwards...
  • Just because this instance of the Frostbite engine (BFII) is laggy and buggy, doesn't mean it applies to every Frostbite game. Battlefield 1 ran incredibly smooth, with some of the best visuals of any game ever. BFV is looking to be another improvement, whether it be graphics, net code, or physics.

    I'd say the lag and bugs you talk about have more to do with the lack of experience on BFII's dev team, rather then the engine itself.
  • bfloo
    14091 posts Member
    The terrain and ping issues with Frostbite are awful.

    The graphics are nice, but aren't that much better for how poorly the games run at time.

    I've played 3, all 3 have the same issues.
    The Knights of Gareth are Eternal

    Pirate of the Knights of Gareth

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  • t3hBar0n wrote: »
    My game runs well, and I have a core I5 from like 5 years ago with a gtx1080 and 32 gigs ram with SSD...

    1080p screen?
  • Alex64
    5627 posts Member
    Terrain psychics are atrocious, objects like chairs can be your worst enemy.
  • Sniffy44
    366 posts Member
    I've been reading things on the forums and reddit and people keep bringing up how unstable and glitchy things can become with Frostbite. From lag, to glitches the engine has a hard time to keep everything in check because all these ultra immersive graphics eat away at the resources and precious memory, thus bugs and glitches are always coming up as a result of never ending optimazations that just can't never be fully successful. The time where great graphics and great performance hasn't arrived yet. Maybe with next gen quantum computing and other tech advancements things will get better.

    Used on many games, EA has too much invested in it to throw away. dont expect it to go anywhere.
  • bfloo wrote: »
    The terrain and ping issues with Frostbite are awful.

    The graphics are nice, but aren't that much better for how poorly the games run at time.

    I've played 3, all 3 have the same issues.

    The reason EA games run poorly online is because they don't region/ping lock servers, they have no warning/ban system for a poor unstable connection.
  • I've played DICE games since Bad Company 2, can confirm Frostbite has been a buggy engine for awhile

    It wasn't always this way, the first Frostbite back in the Bad Company games was fine, but EA pushed DICE to upgrade the engine not once, but twice between Battlefield 3 and 4

    That lead to the launch debacle of Battlefield 4, where the game was nigh on unplayable for many. Personally I've never seen a buggier game beta in my life

    Engines been a buggy mess since Battlefield 4 tbh, where they had to upgrade it to push the Levolution mechanics. Engine pumps out great graphics and sound, but at the cost of being buggy as hell
  • bfloo
    14091 posts Member
    bfloo wrote: »
    The terrain and ping issues with Frostbite are awful.

    The graphics are nice, but aren't that much better for how poorly the games run at time.

    I've played 3, all 3 have the same issues.

    The reason EA games run poorly online is because they don't region/ping lock servers, they have no warning/ban system for a poor unstable connection.

    It isn't a connection issue, I just get stuck on every little thing.

    I don't have this issue on any of the other engines.
    The Knights of Gareth are Eternal

    Pirate of the Knights of Gareth

    h846398gb27k.png


  • Evazan127
    8105 posts Member
    Battlefield seems fine to me
  • I wish I had taken a "programming for video games" type class in college. Well, if a class like that exists. I have so many about the computational stuff going on.

    I do think video games are a bit away from quantum computing. Even the physicists are still working on that stuff lol
  • I hope that some games will stop using frostbite. Not things like Battlefront II, because like... I dont really care about the game engine, its just a thing. But in some of my favorite games, like Dragon Age and Mass Effect - their latest instalments have used Frostbite and sure the games are pretty but it isnt meant for RPGs apparently and BioWare have struggled to create the games in an unfamiliar engine, rather than their own that they used before iirc. I would prefer them not to use Frostbite again, whereas with Battlefront II I probably wont notice a difference either way :P
    "The question," she replied, "Is not whether you will love, hurt, dream, and die. It is what you will love, why you will hurt, when you will dream, and how you will die. This is your choice. You cannot pick the destination, only the path." - Oathbringer.
  • Frostbite runs OK when all players connections are somewhat close.
    As soon as even one laggy connection enters the picture, things destabilize rather quickly for everybody in the lobby.
    Dice knows this, yet they continue to intermix connections in matches that have zero business being together.

    As posted earlier, Bad Company 2 was the last good version of Frostbite, as all the important decisions were server side and if your connection was bad, only you suffered...

    It needs a major revamp, plus they need to increase the darn tick rate. Some days it seems to be set at 1 >:-(
  • TheScape
    1910 posts Member
    The stuff I said about devs defense on the difficulty to patch bugs is true. Testing bugs in their own testing environment is different from real online environment. Devs stated multiple times they have had issues with these things.

    As for what other people said, they made good analysis and summarized common issues across all Frostbite games

    To be fair, you can't compare a test environment that is probably optimised for testing where all people might be sharing the same connection than a live environment with people from around the world connecting with different ISPs... It is inexcusable for some of the bugs that do not heavily depend on netcode, but there is a big reason why one thing does not compare to the other.
    May your heart be your guiding key.
  • lag compensation and out of region access to servers... ruin every Frostbite game.
  • EA_Cian
    1225 posts EA Staff (retired)
    This conversation's been inactive for a little bit now so keeping that in mind I am gonna lock it.
This discussion has been closed.

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