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Darth Vader and Luke need some damage buffs

After the recent heroes updates (health cards and release of Grievous and Kenobi) heroes like Vader and Luke feel less effective in Galactic Assault, and Luke need it even for heroes vs villains.
In Galactic Assault Kenobi and Grievous are able to one shot infantry and they have high damages on sabers.
My suggestions are these:

Darth Vader:

Base damages = from 120 to 130. He is slow at swing and his strikes are easy to avoid as Grievous.

Focused rage damages = from 140 to 150. In this way he can one shot 3 type of infatry when this ability is active, and have sense so it can have an actual impact active it.

Force choke: from 130 to 150, at least only in Galactic Assault. His choke is risky and buggy to use in GA, so he need to OHK infantry to be useful enough.

Luke:

Base damages: from 100 to 120. His actual damage is very low and he is slower than Maul and Rey at swing.

Saber rush: from 100 to 120/130. Is not effective as Maul and Yoda rush. So it need a better reward when you land the hit.

Force push: against villains it inflict 90 damages. It need to be at least 120.

Repulse: against villains it need to be at least 120/130.

These are not big changes but can contribute to improve these 2 characters a little, Vader mainly in Galactic Assault, Luke mainly in heroes vs villains.



Replies

  • DarthCapa2
    2066 posts Member
    edited November 30
    Luke can also receive a health regen buff from 200 to 250. Kenobi can regen 300 at base + 100 with cards and he isn't so slower than Luke. So Luke need 250 or anotger speed buff if you want make him unique.
  • XD
    Heroes more OP ? No thanks
    ddw3rc11mp2j.jpg
  • Landeaux2
    2867 posts Member
    edited November 30
    Vader seems fine vs troopers. But then again, if Vader buffs vs troopers meant Luke buffs vs heroes, so be it.
  • Make vader quicker and his choke instant kill like bof2015. Vader can get melted with his choke animation easily.
  • XD
    Heroes more OP ? No thanks

    Only some heroes are very good. Others need some love.
  • If this happens the choke saber throw combo has to be removed.
    jexdw69dwod3.png
  • Vader is a beast the way he is now.
  • Vader is fine, he can tear through players, and can 1v2 heroes.

    Luke - yes he needs a damage buff across the board, and his abilities to work more than they do.
  • Axone
    298 posts Member
    If this happens the choke saber throw combo has to be removed.

    that too. Vader combo need a delay between each use. Vader buff will most likely never happen in term of realistically. No pun intended.

    I don't want Vader nerf unless there is a good logical evidence or hard-core evidence.

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  • MC_XIX
    1074 posts Member
    Vader's Choke is a pretty bad ability in GA, so yeah, I support a buff. Why was it nerfed so it no longer groups enemies together?
  • MC_XIX wrote: »
    Vader's Choke is a pretty bad ability in GA, so yeah, I support a buff. Why was it nerfed so it no longer groups enemies together?

    This. Now is even worse, it really needs a dmg buff or dmg resistance to compensate.
  • AbyssWatch3r
    3473 posts Member
    edited December 1
    Thats just the crap apart about most of these saber users. Too low regen, slow and over exaggerated swings, not hitting hard enough, and still being shot while attacking. Always on peoples Radar. Completely nerfed Jump physics. Just a massive TTK increase across the board.

    Then you look at some of their abilities, just wow. Plagued by just 3 main problems

    1. Stupidly long cast animations that Completely immobilize you for a second or two, essentially a self stun that varies in duration, 9/10s cannot be cancelled immediately. Anybody that mains maul, Luke, rey, and especially obi-wan know what I'm talking about here. Getting your ability rolled or blocked by the terrain and literally losing 75% of your HP over the cast duration is just broken.
    2. Incomplete Kits: I'm talking about abilities here that usually do more Harm than good to use against infantry, and sometimes even Heroes. Rey's Mind trick. Luke's repulse/push/dash(patched). Obi-Wans mind trick and Force Push. Grievous's Unrelenting Advance and thrust surge. Mauls Force Choke and saber throw. Kylo just isn't able to individually capitalize on his. Vaders Force Choke literally being his most vulnerable state for easy damage.
    3. Requiring certain star cards to be even remotely effective, with many being all but functionally viable. This goes for all Heroes to be honest. Ever care to ask yourself why everyones running the same build 90% of the time? Yeah, its because all other options are fundamentally bad or way too situational.
  • MC_XIX wrote: »
    Vader's Choke is a pretty bad ability in GA, so yeah, I support a buff. Why was it nerfed so it no longer groups enemies together?

    Wasn't nerfed they said that it was a bug
  • Vader needs a buff???

    Hahahahahhahahahahaha
  • Sabers should one shot tbh, but that probably isn't happening. Before they get buffed though separate balancing on GA and HvV needs to happen.
    You guys are gonna make me rich......
    Xbox G-tag
    XJO461
    That Specialist rework was disappointing.
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  • GenxDarchi wrote: »
    Sabers should one shot tbh, but that probably isn't happening. Before they get buffed though separate balancing on GA and HvV needs to happen.

    No more balancing for HvV, the scrubs complaining there just ruin the game making already paltry Hero Performance in GA even worse. Each Hero has a few viable abilities as is. You also literally can't balance a gank by default either, its like putting Jon Jones and McGregor in the same octagon against you but to make it fair they go in Handcuffed, and its sold as a professional fight. Just a trash show for everybody to witness. If Hero showdown was an actual 1v1 like it implied, then we'd have something real to actually analyze instead of hyperbole. The problem however has been Clear though since launch it has all to do with Saber combat, and roll frames if you boil it all down.
  • Vader is good, but Luke, I can only agree, he is pretty weak (but less than in the beginning of the game).
  • Defbored wrote: »
    Vader is a beast the way he is now.

    He is a beast in Heroes vs villains, not in GA. Why pick Vader over Maul or Grievous in GA now? Considering the new heroes and the recent heroes updates, Vader is no more so special in GA.
  • Why Obi-Wan can one shot infantry at least from behind and Vader can't with his rage?
  • Luke sucks out loud.
  • A viable alternative for Luke is adjusting a card to increase his damage vs. villains, like Yoda's.
    PSN: Atreus-213
    Xbox One GT: Atreus215
  • Defbored wrote: »
    Vader is a beast the way he is now.

    He was a monster when he could solo the side, how I miss those days
  • Drectuss
    20 posts Member
    edited December 2
    Luke's buff made him do more damage against infantry and less to villains, completely senseless. His repulse deals 75% of the damage of a single swing, while his saber damage is too low for his medium swing speed. Increase his saber damage to 110 and make his repulse deal 150-200 damage against villains. Or better yet, give him the same damage values he has against infantry.
  • Drectuss wrote: »
    Luke's buff made him do more damage against infantry and less to villains, completely senseless. His repulse deals 75% of the damage of a single swing, while his saber damage is too low for his medium swing speed. Increase his saber damage to 110 and make his repulse deal 150-200 damage against villains. Or better yet, give him the same damage values he has against infantry.

    120 on saber damages in my opinion. And 130 on repulse as against infantry. 200 is too much considering that is area effect damage
  • AmStraightBut50Is50
    101 posts Member
    edited December 3
    GenxDarchi wrote: »
    Sabers should one shot tbh, but that probably isn't happening. Before they get buffed though separate balancing on GA and HvV needs to happen.

    Considering Grievous can do that with Sith Trained now. I agree. Dice have made it happen with one hero, may as well do something similar for every hero. If not 150 damage by default with each swing, one-shotting 3 of the base infantry classes with the exception being the Heavy, (just like it is with Grievous right now) make a similar card to Sith Trained for every hero.

    But then again, the crybaby nerfherders would probably cry that it would be too overpowered or something. Even though most don't have a single clue about proper game balance.

    150 dmg per swing would probably work best on Vader since he can be so slow sometimes in terms of movement speed. That and he's a huge target with his size and the black suit.
    r07jdwtlplwd.gif
  • GenxDarchi wrote: »
    Sabers should one shot tbh, but that probably isn't happening. Before they get buffed though separate balancing on GA and HvV needs to happen.

    Considering Grievous can do that with Sith Trained now. I agree. Dice have made it happen with one hero, may as well do something similar for every hero. If not 150 damage by default with each swing, one-shotting 3 of the base infantry classes with the exception being the Heavy, (just like it is with Grievous right now) make a similar card to Sith Trained for every hero.

    But then again, the crybaby nerfherders would probably cry that it would be too overpowered or something. Even though most don't have a single clue about proper game balance.

    150 dmg per swing would probably work best on Vader since he can be so slow sometimes in terms of movement speed. That and he's a huge target with his size and the black suit.

    At this point one shot for everyone is hard to obtain, but if Grievous can, at least Vader should one shot with his rage active, and some characters like Luke should have more damages on their bae attack. Or yes, they can change some cards that actually are not used at all for increase the damages
  • Vader's damage values should only be adjusted against troopers.

    Luke's damage values should only be adjusted against heroes.

    Let's make this very clear in feedback please.
    PSN: Atreus-213
    Xbox One GT: Atreus215
  • Billkwando
    785 posts Member
    edited December 5
    Atreus213 wrote: »
    A viable alternative for Luke is adjusting a card to increase his damage vs. villains, like Yoda's.

    No.


    You might as well say he should have to equip a card to use his lightsaber. He's gimped enough as it is without taking away cards that make his force moves more effective (by forcing you to replace one of your force cards with a buff card).
    ZI7BNkU.gif
    ^Maximum the Hormone - Alien^
    (Sort of an atypical/joke song, all their other songs are way better)

    Gamertag: Billkwando
    Find me circling, and crashing, in Starfighter Assault.
  • Billkwando wrote: »
    Atreus213 wrote: »
    A viable alternative for Luke is adjusting a card to increase his damage vs. villains, like Yoda's.

    No.


    You might as well say he should have to equip a card to use his lightsaber. He's gimped enough as it is without taking away cards that make his force moves more effective (by forcing you to replace one of your force cards with a buff card).

    Sounds like a problem for people who use pits as a crutch. Otherwise, it won't be hard to give up Epicenter in hero modes when the block-stagger changes come into effect.
    PSN: Atreus-213
    Xbox One GT: Atreus215
  • Billkwando
    785 posts Member
    edited December 5
    Atreus213 wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    Atreus213 wrote: »
    A viable alternative for Luke is adjusting a card to increase his damage vs. villains, like Yoda's.

    No.


    You might as well say he should have to equip a card to use his lightsaber. He's gimped enough as it is without taking away cards that make his force moves more effective (by forcing you to replace one of your force cards with a buff card).

    Sounds like a problem for people who use pits as a crutch. Otherwise, it won't be hard to give up Epicenter in hero modes when the block-stagger changes come into effect.

    When they nerf Vader and Greebus' damage and then give them cards to regain what had been their default damage, I will accept that. I don't use epicenter btw. I use the one that makes the circle bigger (Strong Repulse?) to stop runners. I use that and the 2 Push cards. I tried giving up the repulse card but then I missed too many flying Bobas/running Mauls and had to go back. LOL

    It's not too much to ask that Luke be slightly more competitive against his dad, cards aside. He did beat him down and chop his arm off, after all. I'm not asking for all that.
    ZI7BNkU.gif
    ^Maximum the Hormone - Alien^
    (Sort of an atypical/joke song, all their other songs are way better)

    Gamertag: Billkwando
    Find me circling, and crashing, in Starfighter Assault.
  • No they’re fine
  • Billkwando wrote: »
    Atreus213 wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    Atreus213 wrote: »
    A viable alternative for Luke is adjusting a card to increase his damage vs. villains, like Yoda's.

    No.


    You might as well say he should have to equip a card to use his lightsaber. He's gimped enough as it is without taking away cards that make his force moves more effective (by forcing you to replace one of your force cards with a buff card).

    Sounds like a problem for people who use pits as a crutch. Otherwise, it won't be hard to give up Epicenter in hero modes when the block-stagger changes come into effect.

    When they nerf Vader and Greebus' damage and then give them cards to regain what had been their default damage, I will accept that. I don't use epicenter btw. I use the one that makes the circle bigger (Strong Repulse?) to stop runners. I use that and the 2 Push cards. I tried giving up the repulse card but then I missed too many flying Bobas/running Mauls and had to go back. LOL

    It's not too much to ask that Luke be slightly more competitive against his dad, cards aside. He did beat him down and chop his arm off, after all. I'm not asking for all that.

    I get you. I prefer a flat damage increase for Luke but if I have to settle for a card like Yoda's, I will.
    PSN: Atreus-213
    Xbox One GT: Atreus215
  • nas9091 wrote: »
    No they’re fine

    Luke isn't.
    jexdw69dwod3.png
  • Atreus213 wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    Atreus213 wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    Atreus213 wrote: »
    A viable alternative for Luke is adjusting a card to increase his damage vs. villains, like Yoda's.

    No.


    You might as well say he should have to equip a card to use his lightsaber. He's gimped enough as it is without taking away cards that make his force moves more effective (by forcing you to replace one of your force cards with a buff card).

    Sounds like a problem for people who use pits as a crutch. Otherwise, it won't be hard to give up Epicenter in hero modes when the block-stagger changes come into effect.

    When they nerf Vader and Greebus' damage and then give them cards to regain what had been their default damage, I will accept that. I don't use epicenter btw. I use the one that makes the circle bigger (Strong Repulse?) to stop runners. I use that and the 2 Push cards. I tried giving up the repulse card but then I missed too many flying Bobas/running Mauls and had to go back. LOL

    It's not too much to ask that Luke be slightly more competitive against his dad, cards aside. He did beat him down and chop his arm off, after all. I'm not asking for all that.

    I get you. I prefer a flat damage increase for Luke but if I have to settle for a card like Yoda's, I will.

    27y594X.jpg
    ZI7BNkU.gif
    ^Maximum the Hormone - Alien^
    (Sort of an atypical/joke song, all their other songs are way better)

    Gamertag: Billkwando
    Find me circling, and crashing, in Starfighter Assault.
  • Who's played star Wars the Force Unleashed here? That's how luke should be modeled, overwhelming his enemies with powerful force abilities and insane mobility. Right now He's underwhelming them.

    Make All abilities useable in the air, and reduce the cool down of both repulse and push by 4 seconds each. He should be able to fly around with saber dash to make him a more unpredictable target, and easily chain them into his force attacks.
  • JMaster
    1972 posts Member
    edited December 5
    I'm ambivalent about Vader, as he's one of my favorites and one of the best characters in the game already... but there are some very substantial changes I want to see with Heroes. I'd love to see all lightsabers one hit kill all *unbuffed* infantry classes ONLY. The damages they deal to other heroes is fine. Ideally they should also work on healing being a base attribute for ALL heroes, but that's another discussion.
    Now... that's very unlikely, so the least I want are for Luke (and Kylo) to get about 120 saber damage apiece. I also want Luke's (broken) deflection card to A) Be applied to Luke normally since he does it in the films and can Tupoc himself across the universe and B ) Have it turned into an extra damage card, either for all characters or just heroes, I don't mind. Just my bad thoughts, you?
    "I felt there was a large amount of human chauvinism... also I felt very bad that at the end the Wookie didn't get a medal also... oh, all the people got medals but the Wookie who had been in there fighting all the time, didn't get any medal, and I thought that was an example of Anti-Wookie discrimination." - Carl Sagan on the subject of Star Wars
    He knew.
  • Just make choke kill everyone on the map at once and Luke using push do the same and instant kill. For real they are both fine no buffs or nerfs needed
  • JediJulius
    184 posts Member
    edited December 6
    I think Luke should:

    1. Get his base saber increased from 100 to 110. Increase Rush damage to 110 as well. This at least makes him more normal.
    2. Get his rear strike damage bonus (that all saber heroes have) increased by an extra 10 or 20 (unique to him) so that flanking and using his speed to get around enemies is rewarded.
    3. Increase his push and repulse damage towards villains like you suggest.
    4. Get a 2.5% saber swing speed increase, especially on his sprinting attack.
    5. Make 'Jedi Fighter's' stamina decrease up to 12.5% at purple level to better match up with newer Star Card strengths and be more useful.
    6. Remove the stamina penalty from 'Deflection Mastery' and instead make it a flat deflection angle radius decrease (20/30/40/50%).
    7. Make Force Push and Repulse actually hit enemies more consistently.
    8. Make repulse be performed about 10% faster.
    9. Give him more skins please.


    These changes are a ton of fairly minor changes, but I feel would help at least make his damage output better as well as making his saber strikes and repulse a bit faster and smoother. Plus some of his less used star cards will be better.
  • DarthCapa2 wrote: »
    Defbored wrote: »
    Vader is a beast the way he is now.

    He is a beast in Heroes vs villains, not in GA. Why pick Vader over Maul or Grievous in GA now? Considering the new heroes and the recent heroes updates, Vader is no more so special in GA.

    What?? He's top 5 hero maul can't even hold or take an objective by his self & his damage output is weak.
  • All lightsabers should be ohk on infantry imo. Especially since 1/3 hits accualy register.

    For the HvV damage i think that all lightsabers should be right below Grievous damage +- a couple of points depending on who it is. Would speed up the gameplay a bit as well.

  • DarthCapa2 wrote: »
    Defbored wrote: »
    Vader is a beast the way he is now.

    He is a beast in Heroes vs villains, not in GA. Why pick Vader over Maul or Grievous in GA now? Considering the new heroes and the recent heroes updates, Vader is no more so special in GA.

    What?? He's top 5 hero maul can't even hold or take an objective by his self & his damage output is weak.

    After Maul get the health card is better than Vader imho
  • DarthCapa2 wrote: »
    DarthCapa2 wrote: »
    Defbored wrote: »
    Vader is a beast the way he is now.

    He is a beast in Heroes vs villains, not in GA. Why pick Vader over Maul or Grievous in GA now? Considering the new heroes and the recent heroes updates, Vader is no more so special in GA.

    What?? He's top 5 hero maul can't even hold or take an objective by his self & his damage output is weak.

    After Maul get the health card is better than Vader imho

    Nah
  • DarthCapa2 wrote: »
    DarthCapa2 wrote: »
    Defbored wrote: »
    Vader is a beast the way he is now.

    He is a beast in Heroes vs villains, not in GA. Why pick Vader over Maul or Grievous in GA now? Considering the new heroes and the recent heroes updates, Vader is no more so special in GA.

    What?? He's top 5 hero maul can't even hold or take an objective by his self & his damage output is weak.

    After Maul get the health card is better than Vader imho

    Nah

    Ya
  • I also feel like Luke doesn't land hits very frequently, anyone else notice that? It's difficult when people roll around, but some of Luke's swing animations in-inadvertently result in you not even hitting your target.

    It's had me killed many o'time now.
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