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Galactic Assault and Capital Supremacy are better without heroes. Period.

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Replies

  • Neonred_90 wrote: »
    I don't like that either. bad players screen camp, use a hero for 12 seconds, and then get killed. All that's needed is a short death timer which keeps that hero from being picked back to back

    Sorry, the cost bump would be for the individual picking the hero over and over, penalty not on the entire team.

    Oh I see. In that case yes, I actually like that idea.
  • The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.
  • PGombi wrote: »
    The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.
    Speeders are working as intended. Passive HoK is fine. I think the Hero Haters are honestly the vocal minority. Why do you think so many people screen camp for heroes?
  • PGombi
    84 posts Member
    edited December 2019
    PGombi wrote: »
    The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.
    Speeders are working as intended. Passive HoK is fine. I think the Hero Haters are honestly the vocal minority. Why do you think so many people screen camp for heroes?

    Don't get me wrong, I don't hate heroes in general. From time to time I choose one when he/she is available. But I'm not explicitely waiting for one to become available. In Battlefront 1 (2015) I think it was very balanced. One hero at any given time, and when in the hands of a skilled player they were a real nuisance.
    But in this game ... man, the gameplay becomes so toxic when you have such tryhard hero players on the field. I have encountered hero players finishing with 120+ elims in one match, then in the next they failed to get the first two heroes, abandoned the team and the match. Or they get killed mid-match and quit. And I also think, by making heroes more and more overpowered, DICE has encouraged this kind of playstyle --> troopers are minions, heroes are gods.
    I have never played a Star Wars game, that I love and hate that much at the same time.
  • PGombi wrote: »
    The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.
    Speeders are working as intended. Passive HoK is fine. I think the Hero Haters are honestly the vocal minority. Why do you think so many people screen camp for heroes?

    To be able to stomp their opponents. If heroplay is so important to them, why not play HvV without screen camping where they can play a hero all day long?

    It’s not only the heroes. All tiered gameplay is ruining this game.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    PGombi wrote: »
    The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.
    Speeders are working as intended. Passive HoK is fine. I think the Hero Haters are honestly the vocal minority. Why do you think so many people screen camp for heroes?

    To be able to stomp their opponents. If heroplay is so important to them, why not play HvV without screen camping where they can play a hero all day long?

    It’s not only the heroes. All tiered gameplay is ruining this game.

    Even vehicles?
  • PGombi wrote: »
    PGombi wrote: »
    The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.
    Speeders are working as intended. Passive HoK is fine. I think the Hero Haters are honestly the vocal minority. Why do you think so many people screen camp for heroes?

    Don't get me wrong, I don't hate heroes in general. From time to time I choose one when he/she is available. But I'm not explicitely waiting for one to become available. In Battlefront 1 (2015) I think it was very balanced. One hero at any given time, and when in the hands of a skilled player they were a real nuisance.
    But in this game ... man, the gameplay becomes so toxic when you have such tryhard hero players on the field. I have encountered hero players finishing with 120+ elims in one match, then in the next they failed to get the first two heroes, abandoned the team and the match. Or they get killed mid-match and quit. And I also think, by making heroes more and more overpowered, DICE has encouraged this kind of playstyle --> troopers are minions, heroes are gods.
    I have never played a Star Wars game, that I love and hate that much at the same time.

    I think a timer, BP increase, stinger revert are all justified. There will always be quitters in multiplayer games. Fact of life.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    PGombi wrote: »
    The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.
    Speeders are working as intended. Passive HoK is fine. I think the Hero Haters are honestly the vocal minority. Why do you think so many people screen camp for heroes?

    To be able to stomp their opponents. If heroplay is so important to them, why not play HvV without screen camping where they can play a hero all day long?

    It’s not only the heroes. All tiered gameplay is ruining this game.

    Even vehicles?

    Vehicles are easy to counter. They are slow moving targets. They have huge hitboxes, and with the correct loadout, i.e. smart ion grenade, ion torpedoes, very easily destroyed.

    Heroes / villains on the other hand are fast as hell, can dodge, have their abilities, regenerate health with every kill, .... shall I go on.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    PGombi wrote: »
    The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.
    Speeders are working as intended. Passive HoK is fine. I think the Hero Haters are honestly the vocal minority. Why do you think so many people screen camp for heroes?

    To be able to stomp their opponents. If heroplay is so important to them, why not play HvV without screen camping where they can play a hero all day long?

    It’s not only the heroes. All tiered gameplay is ruining this game.

    Even vehicles?

    We have spoken about this before.
    I told you, infantry has ways of dealing effectively with vehicles.

    If you don’t accept that there’s not much else I can say.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    skincarver wrote: »
    PGombi wrote: »
    The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.
    Speeders are working as intended. Passive HoK is fine. I think the Hero Haters are honestly the vocal minority. Why do you think so many people screen camp for heroes?

    To be able to stomp their opponents. If heroplay is so important to them, why not play HvV without screen camping where they can play a hero all day long?

    It’s not only the heroes. All tiered gameplay is ruining this game.

    Even vehicles?

    We have spoken about this before.
    I told you, infantry has ways of dealing effectively with vehicles.

    If you don’t accept that there’s not much else I can say.

    I guess I just don't get it. I've seen clips of ATSTs and AATs going on massive killstreaks. A tiered unit is a tiered unit. Troopers have ways of dealing with heroes too. I guess lll just move past it lol. I still want trooper lords to have their own mode.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    skincarver wrote: »
    PGombi wrote: »
    The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.
    Speeders are working as intended. Passive HoK is fine. I think the Hero Haters are honestly the vocal minority. Why do you think so many people screen camp for heroes?

    To be able to stomp their opponents. If heroplay is so important to them, why not play HvV without screen camping where they can play a hero all day long?

    It’s not only the heroes. All tiered gameplay is ruining this game.

    Even vehicles?

    We have spoken about this before.
    I told you, infantry has ways of dealing effectively with vehicles.

    If you don’t accept that there’s not much else I can say.

    Although I agree on the fact that troopers can deal with vehicles, there is not really much they can do as base classes, talking Assault, heavy, Officer and Sniper. None of those can really beat a tank. There is no such thing as c4 or something that would make this "easy". Furthermore, the heavy, who should be a "danger" to the tank, can barely do anything against it. Even ion shots and ion grenade launcher is not as helpful as it could or should be. At least that is my opinion / what I have experienced after 2 years.

  • With some smart positioning I can take out an AAT by myself with the NT and disruptor shot.
    ATSTs are a tougher nut to crack, one committed heavy with ion torpedo deals good damage, still it requires several players to shoot it.
    When they do however, even ATSTs go down fast, seen in takodana when defending the hilltop.
  • The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    I'll agree that the stinger nerf was completely unnecessary.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF

    If the trooper squad suck then yes. A competent coordinated squad of troopers can take down any hero in the game. Period.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF

    If the trooper squad suck then yes. A competent coordinated squad of troopers can take down any hero in the game. Period.

    But when do you have a coordinated squad full of randoms?
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF

    If the trooper squad suck then yes. A competent coordinated squad of troopers can take down any hero in the game. Period.

    Even then: no. Especially someone like Ani with his 360 attacks easily will kill you, even if you come from 4 seperate sides and even with verticality in it. And even if you deal enough damage, with the kills he does when wiping you out, he instantly gets health back so it was nearly wasted.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF

    If the trooper squad suck then yes. A competent coordinated squad of troopers can take down any hero in the game. Period.

    But when do you have a coordinated squad full of randoms?

    Randoms? Almost never. But I usually only play HvV with randoms. If I'm in GA or CS I've got friends with me 100% of the time. Still, a good deal of hero players are potatoes and will rush head first into my TL50, rendering them dead lol.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF

    If the trooper squad suck then yes. A competent coordinated squad of troopers can take down any hero in the game. Period.

    Even then: no. Especially someone like Ani with his 360 attacks easily will kill you, even if you come from 4 seperate sides and even with verticality in it. And even if you deal enough damage, with the kills he does when wiping you out, he instantly gets health back so it was nearly wasted.

    I just avoid heroes in CS. There's better things I can be doing with my time than to fight in an uneven match. In GA, it's a bit more justified because I can just spawn back fast and still play the objective, but in CS it's a long walk back. Even as a hero in CS, I won't engage another hero unless I'm backed with other troopers near me. It ensures my survival and their death.
    THIS has all been foreseen.
    j2p7umsm2f8x.jpg
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF

    If the trooper squad suck then yes. A competent coordinated squad of troopers can take down any hero in the game. Period.

    Even then: no. Especially someone like Ani with his 360 attacks easily will kill you, even if you come from 4 seperate sides and even with verticality in it. And even if you deal enough damage, with the kills he does when wiping you out, he instantly gets health back so it was nearly wasted.

    Yes. That's why I said a coordinated squad. Pick at him from a distance and wait for abilities to be spent before you go in for the kill.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF

    If the trooper squad suck then yes. A competent coordinated squad of troopers can take down any hero in the game. Period.

    Even then: no. Especially someone like Ani with his 360 attacks easily will kill you, even if you come from 4 seperate sides and even with verticality in it. And even if you deal enough damage, with the kills he does when wiping you out, he instantly gets health back so it was nearly wasted.

    Yes. That's why I said a coordinated squad. Pick at him from a distance and wait for abilities to be spent before you go in for the kill.

    Capturing command posts is not really possible from a distance you know #objectivesMatter
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF

    If the trooper squad suck then yes. A competent coordinated squad of troopers can take down any hero in the game. Period.

    Even then: no. Especially someone like Ani with his 360 attacks easily will kill you, even if you come from 4 seperate sides and even with verticality in it. And even if you deal enough damage, with the kills he does when wiping you out, he instantly gets health back so it was nearly wasted.

    Yes. That's why I said a coordinated squad. Pick at him from a distance and wait for abilities to be spent before you go in for the kill.

    Capturing command posts is not really possible from a distance you know #objectivesMatter

    I was simply talking about a squad of troopers vs. a hero. Even defendimg a CP is doable though. You have a big red circle on you radar telling when and where the hero is coming from. Take Anakin. If you see it coming you can roll out of pull, and he has to be somewhat close to use HM. At least within blaster range.
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF

    If the trooper squad suck then yes. A competent coordinated squad of troopers can take down any hero in the game. Period.

    Even then: no. Especially someone like Ani with his 360 attacks easily will kill you, even if you come from 4 seperate sides and even with verticality in it. And even if you deal enough damage, with the kills he does when wiping you out, he instantly gets health back so it was nearly wasted.

    Yes. That's why I said a coordinated squad. Pick at him from a distance and wait for abilities to be spent before you go in for the kill.

    Capturing command posts is not really possible from a distance you know #objectivesMatter

    I was simply talking about a squad of troopers vs. a hero. Even defendimg a CP is doable though. You have a big red circle on you radar telling when and where the hero is coming from. Take Anakin. If you see it coming you can roll out of pull, and he has to be somewhat close to use HM. At least within blaster range.

    Yeah, but then you are either fighting him close and die quite quick, or you run away and lose the objective - you get my poiint?
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF

    If the trooper squad suck then yes. A competent coordinated squad of troopers can take down any hero in the game. Period.

    Even then: no. Especially someone like Ani with his 360 attacks easily will kill you, even if you come from 4 seperate sides and even with verticality in it. And even if you deal enough damage, with the kills he does when wiping you out, he instantly gets health back so it was nearly wasted.

    Yes. That's why I said a coordinated squad. Pick at him from a distance and wait for abilities to be spent before you go in for the kill.

    Capturing command posts is not really possible from a distance you know #objectivesMatter

    I was simply talking about a squad of troopers vs. a hero. Even defendimg a CP is doable though. You have a big red circle on you radar telling when and where the hero is coming from. Take Anakin. If you see it coming you can roll out of pull, and he has to be somewhat close to use HM. At least within blaster range.

    Yeah, but then you are either fighting him close and die quite quick, or you run away and lose the objective - you get my poiint?

    I get your point. My point is that if you're all blasting him, you can out DPS him. It takes communication and coordination. That's IF the hero player is any good. Lots of hero players may as well be bots and get melted 12 seconds after spawning in anyway. Heroes are not unkillable gods that some people make them out to be. Yes, some players are great with heroes and can't be touched but the vast majority are screen camping bots who rush headfirst into death. Not trying to say your point isn't also valid, just giving my 2 cents. I'll be done now. I still want trooper players to have their own mode🙂
  • skincarver wrote: »
    The thing is, if it were only vehicles one could adapt his loadout accordingly, but with heroes, reinforcements and vehicles one has to find the middle ground trying to be effective against all that’s trying to kill troopers. We’re lacking the tools, and if effective they’re subject to nerfs.

    Agreed on this one, however, approaching heroes even with a complete squad will get you nothing but killed. Therefore I am not a big fan of 4 heroes per side in GA with hero players still complaining that troopers are too pwerful? WTF

    If the trooper squad suck then yes. A competent coordinated squad of troopers can take down any hero in the game. Period.

    Even then: no. Especially someone like Ani with his 360 attacks easily will kill you, even if you come from 4 seperate sides and even with verticality in it. And even if you deal enough damage, with the kills he does when wiping you out, he instantly gets health back so it was nearly wasted.

    Yes. That's why I said a coordinated squad. Pick at him from a distance and wait for abilities to be spent before you go in for the kill.

    Capturing command posts is not really possible from a distance you know #objectivesMatter

    I was simply talking about a squad of troopers vs. a hero. Even defendimg a CP is doable though. You have a big red circle on you radar telling when and where the hero is coming from. Take Anakin. If you see it coming you can roll out of pull, and he has to be somewhat close to use HM. At least within blaster range.

    Yeah, but then you are either fighting him close and die quite quick, or you run away and lose the objective - you get my poiint?

    I get your point. My point is that if you're all blasting him, you can out DPS him. It takes communication and coordination. That's IF the hero player is any good. Lots of hero players may as well be bots and get melted 12 seconds after spawning in anyway. Heroes are not unkillable gods that some people make them out to be. Yes, some players are great with heroes and can't be touched but the vast majority are screen camping bots who rush headfirst into death. Not trying to say your point isn't also valid, just giving my 2 cents. I'll be done now. I still want trooper players to have their own mode🙂

    Fair enough :)
  • PGombi wrote: »
    PGombi wrote: »
    The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.
    Speeders are working as intended. Passive HoK is fine. I think the Hero Haters are honestly the vocal minority. Why do you think so many people screen camp for heroes?

    Don't get me wrong, I don't hate heroes in general. From time to time I choose one when he/she is available. But I'm not explicitely waiting for one to become available. In Battlefront 1 (2015) I think it was very balanced. One hero at any given time, and when in the hands of a skilled player they were a real nuisance.
    But in this game ... man, the gameplay becomes so toxic when you have such tryhard hero players on the field. I have encountered hero players finishing with 120+ elims in one match, then in the next they failed to get the first two heroes, abandoned the team and the match. Or they get killed mid-match and quit. And I also think, by making heroes more and more overpowered, DICE has encouraged this kind of playstyle --> troopers are minions, heroes are gods.
    I have never played a Star Wars game, that I love and hate that much at the same time.

    I fee this is incredibly well said!! Also adding that I do not hate heroes as the OP. You just lose sooo much great gameplay when there’s such a disparity between a trooper unit, and yes, God level characters on the field.

    I understand there’s a lot of people who like to play the hero-god (I do too) and they were incredibly exciting in these big game modes when the game first came out - but now it’s just repetitive. Just removing heroes, there are many more viable classes you can play and do well with - but some feel it’s only about the hero and insta quite when not getting the first two, as mentioned above.

    **We need a separate and permanent option to enjoy these large game modes without heroes. There are two very distinct groups, pro heroes and against, both being totally valid and it is time for this to happen to keep the game interesting for all parties.**

    Been playing since beta and I’m boycotting until this happens (or next boots on the ground event 😉).
  • I will point out no one had any issues with the old system where a hero or villain was on the field one at a time based on a points/kill count system. Although I can easily see the officer issue being exacerbated by reverting to a point system and one at a time usage. It is a tricky situation, maybe heroes and villains should have a time based system like in the old games where your health slowly drained unless you got kills
  • All this conversation could have been avoided if EA had included a large objective based mode without heroes, inclusion of regular Cargo and DZ as was done in SWBF 15.

    I like heroes and have requested more to be added to the game, K2, R2, Greedo, Jyn, Krennic, and so forth so this is not coming from hero hate although DICE is nudging me in that direction due to the lack of attention to hero free modes. See Extraction as an example or the lack of Cargo, DZ modes and a large objective based mode without heroes.

    Even SA, which is one of the better designed and balanced modes is ignored. (Prove me wrong. Never mind, you can’t)

    Also the inordinate amount of dev resources directed towards the unattainable goal of balancing heroes between 2 separate and completely different modes after 2 years has grown tiresome and predictable. Almost every CT is a bible of hero tweaks which at some point will be changed yet again and again for heroes who’ve been in game since launch. Enough already.

    All I’ve been looking for from DICE is a little better balancing between trooper play modes and hero play modes and it hasn’t happened and unfortunately doesn’t seem to be in any future plans for this game.
  • Captain_Guy
    222 posts Member
    edited December 2019
    All this conversation could have been avoided if EA had included a large objective based mode without heroes, inclusion of regular Cargo and DZ as was done in SWBF 15.

    I like heroes and have requested more to be added to the game, K2, R2, Greedo, Jyn, Krennic, and so forth so this is not coming from hero hate although DICE is nudging me in that direction due to the lack of attention to hero free modes. See Extraction as an example or the lack of Cargo, DZ modes and a large objective based mode without heroes.

    Even SA, which is one of the better designed and balanced modes is ignored. (Prove me wrong. Never mind, you can’t)

    Also the inordinate amount of dev resources directed towards the unattainable goal of balancing heroes between 2 separate and completely different modes after 2 years has grown tiresome and predictable. Almost every CT is a bible of hero tweaks which at some point will be changed yet again and again for heroes who’ve been in game since launch. Enough already.

    All I’ve been looking for from DICE is a little better balancing between trooper play modes and hero play modes and it hasn’t happened and unfortunately doesn’t seem to be in any future plans for this game.

    ** All of this - well said friend!

    They have devoted a TON of resources into heroes that could possibly be directed towards these other directions - especially the modes you mentioned. Star Wars battles, troopers, ships are all pretty much the identity of Star Wars - without them (and John Williams) it would just be another syfy drama. There is a reason why Rouge One was received so well - mostly no Sabers (except that part at the end with Vader - RIP rebel scum, I feel your pain).

    Great post @Jett_Fett_91166

    Post edited by Captain_Guy on
  • Generally speaking, yes Battlefront plays out better without heroes. It was the same way back in 2004 with the original Pandemic games. The very first Battlefront didn't have heroes. They added them for Battlefront 2, and all the sudden you just had to clear out if a hero was in the area. In fact, I think it's easier in this game for heroes to get taken down than the original Battlefront 2.

    That said, I don't care. I think it's perfectly fine to keep them in, and let the boots on the ground events keep cycling. Maybe make it a regular event every month. Galactic Assault isn't fun for me one way or the other. GA is the most boring linear gameplay I could think of for Star Wars Battlefront. It's worse in many cases than Walker Assault in BF2015. Heroes are all but essential to unclog the rampant bottle necks in GA.
  • Plain and simple, add turning point to Battlefront 2
  • You guys reaaaaally want to ruin what little fun there is left in this game.
  • SSJSnoop wrote: »
    You guys reaaaaally want to ruin what little fun there is left in this game.

    Yes, yes they do.
    THIS has all been foreseen.
    j2p7umsm2f8x.jpg
  • polarition wrote: »
    SSJSnoop wrote: »
    You guys reaaaaally want to ruin what little fun there is left in this game.

    Yes, yes they do.

    Actually I don’t want the removal of any content, just a new mode
  • quzndvfppkja.jpeg
    A reminder for everyone that @F8RGE said they’re exploring said reinforcement/hero free mode. Don’t let them forget
  • quzndvfppkja.jpeg
    A reminder for everyone that @F8RGE said they’re exploring said reinforcement/hero free mode. Don’t let them forget

    That actually says trooper/reinforcements only. Does that mean both? Because we already have 2 of those. Or two separate modes, 1 for troopers and 1 for reinforcements?
  • polarition wrote: »
    SSJSnoop wrote: »
    You guys reaaaaally want to ruin what little fun there is left in this game.

    Yes, yes they do.

    How is adding a large objective based mode without heroes, as was done in SWBF 15, ruining anyone’s fun? Still would have regular GA/CS with heroes so what’s the problem? Some of us are not looking to remove heroes, just an available alternative like we had in 15. That’s it.
  • quzndvfppkja.jpeg
    A reminder for everyone that @F8RGE said they’re exploring said reinforcement/hero free mode. Don’t let them forget

    That actually says trooper/reinforcements only. Does that mean both? Because we already have 2 of those. Or two separate modes, 1 for troopers and 1 for reinforcements?

    He discussed it a little bit more with the people in the thread, the general feedback landed on Heroes only which made sense since the thread was “we need a large scale objective game mode with no reinforcements/heroes”
  • polarition wrote: »
    SSJSnoop wrote: »
    You guys reaaaaally want to ruin what little fun there is left in this game.

    Yes, yes they do.

    How is adding a large objective based mode without heroes, as was done in SWBF 15, ruining anyone’s fun? Still would have regular GA/CS with heroes so what’s the problem? Some of us are not looking to remove heroes, just an available alternative like we had in 15. That’s it.

    The original post called for adding a permanent variation of CS/GA that's locked to troopers only. What you're basically asking for is for DICE to create a duplicate mode that's exactly the same but with no heroes which is not a highly demanded mode. This creation would only serve to split the population of CS/GA players between playing those modes and playing the modes without them. It would be problematic to the success of each modes by leading to less players in both of the modes. It's the same reason why they merged extraction with strike. Both modes had low popularity so they merged them together to increase it as a whole. You'd only get the same result and would ruin the fun of others because of the less likely chance you'll be put in a full session of players.

    BoTG is a perfect middle ground between the two, which is why it's only as an event and also increases traffic. Players can play the mode without the interference of heroes, but the mode goes back to normal following the weekend without splitting the amount of players who play the mode.
    THIS has all been foreseen.
    j2p7umsm2f8x.jpg
  • polarition wrote: »
    polarition wrote: »
    SSJSnoop wrote: »
    You guys reaaaaally want to ruin what little fun there is left in this game.

    Yes, yes they do.

    How is adding a large objective based mode without heroes, as was done in SWBF 15, ruining anyone’s fun? Still would have regular GA/CS with heroes so what’s the problem? Some of us are not looking to remove heroes, just an available alternative like we had in 15. That’s it.

    The original post called for adding a permanent variation of CS/GA that's locked to troopers only. What you're basically asking for is for DICE to create a duplicate mode that's exactly the same but with no heroes which is not a highly demanded mode. This creation would only serve to split the population of CS/GA players between playing those modes and playing the modes without them. It would be problematic to the success of each modes by leading to less players in both of the modes. It's the same reason why they merged extraction with strike. Both modes had low popularity so they merged them together to increase it as a whole. You'd only get the same result and would ruin the fun of others because of the less likely chance you'll be put in a full session of players.

    BoTG is a perfect middle ground between the two, which is why it's only as an event and also increases traffic. Players can play the mode without the interference of heroes, but the mode goes back to normal following the weekend without splitting the amount of players who play the mode.


    I hear your argument that it would reduce player size, but realistically many fewer people will play with the version which includes heroes, than without them - so again we are catering to the minority that finds heroes essential and can only enjoy the game as a hero (again I like them and play them myself, but find separate modes necessary for GA and CS).

    As you said the BotG events causes an uptick in people playing, so you’re technically not losing anything, because you would be gaining people who are otherwise choosing not to play - at least some of which for the reasons already mentioned.

    If not separate modes then maybe they add a universal star card for the trooper classes that lets you pull out the rifle from The Mandalorian to disintegrate them like a Jawa, that’s fair right? One shot kill power abilities are exactly why people use heroes for killstreaks in the first place, right? 😈
  • polarition wrote: »
    polarition wrote: »
    SSJSnoop wrote: »
    You guys reaaaaally want to ruin what little fun there is left in this game.

    Yes, yes they do.

    How is adding a large objective based mode without heroes, as was done in SWBF 15, ruining anyone’s fun? Still would have regular GA/CS with heroes so what’s the problem? Some of us are not looking to remove heroes, just an available alternative like we had in 15. That’s it.

    The original post called for adding a permanent variation of CS/GA that's locked to troopers only. What you're basically asking for is for DICE to create a duplicate mode that's exactly the same but with no heroes which is not a highly demanded mode. This creation would only serve to split the population of CS/GA players between playing those modes and playing the modes without them. It would be problematic to the success of each modes by leading to less players in both of the modes. It's the same reason why they merged extraction with strike. Both modes had low popularity so they merged them together to increase it as a whole. You'd only get the same result and would ruin the fun of others because of the less likely chance you'll be put in a full session of players.

    BoTG is a perfect middle ground between the two, which is why it's only as an event and also increases traffic. Players can play the mode without the interference of heroes, but the mode goes back to normal following the weekend without splitting the amount of players who play the mode.

    SWBF15 managed to do it and do it well. Many players who enjoyed large mode play without heroes gave up on this game long ago. I’d think providing it would bring players back to the game which would lessen any impact on splitting the player base.
  • polarition wrote: »
    polarition wrote: »
    SSJSnoop wrote: »
    You guys reaaaaally want to ruin what little fun there is left in this game.

    Yes, yes they do.

    How is adding a large objective based mode without heroes, as was done in SWBF 15, ruining anyone’s fun? Still would have regular GA/CS with heroes so what’s the problem? Some of us are not looking to remove heroes, just an available alternative like we had in 15. That’s it.

    The original post called for adding a permanent variation of CS/GA that's locked to troopers only. What you're basically asking for is for DICE to create a duplicate mode that's exactly the same but with no heroes which is not a highly demanded mode. This creation would only serve to split the population of CS/GA players between playing those modes and playing the modes without them. It would be problematic to the success of each modes by leading to less players in both of the modes. It's the same reason why they merged extraction with strike. Both modes had low popularity so they merged them together to increase it as a whole. You'd only get the same result and would ruin the fun of others because of the less likely chance you'll be put in a full session of players.

    BoTG is a perfect middle ground between the two, which is why it's only as an event and also increases traffic. Players can play the mode without the interference of heroes, but the mode goes back to normal following the weekend without splitting the amount of players who play the mode.

    SWBF15 managed to do it and do it well. Many players who enjoyed large mode play without heroes gave up on this game long ago. I’d think providing it would bring players back to the game which would lessen any impact on splitting the player base.

    It might even convince some of the people who only play 15 to come over
  • Turning Point worked very well in the previous Battlefront title, so I believe it would also work well in this game, too. There is definitely a crowd of people who would enjoy a Hero-free large objective-based mode (including me) to complement the Battlefront experience already offered here.

    In my experiences playing GA and CS during the Boots on the Ground event, matches were more tense and down-to-the-wire. Teams used more flanking tactics, held the line longer, and on the whole, performed well, giving the objective everything they had. It felt exhilarating to take part in. The matches felt less like a chaotic stampeding Bantha herd trampling helpless Jawas and more like an actual battle. But that's just what I observed.

    I have my issue with Heroes (mostly regarding their number and frequent appearances during matches), and I'm definitely not a fan of them, but I do concede that they do have their place in this game, as do Troopers.
  • relleuM
    255 posts Member
    edited December 2019
    I disagree, I usually play GA and found myself playing HvV during the trooper event. I tried a couple rounds of GA with troopers only and found it insanely boring and lacking.
  • polarition wrote: »
    polarition wrote: »
    SSJSnoop wrote: »
    You guys reaaaaally want to ruin what little fun there is left in this game.

    Yes, yes they do.

    How is adding a large objective based mode without heroes, as was done in SWBF 15, ruining anyone’s fun? Still would have regular GA/CS with heroes so what’s the problem? Some of us are not looking to remove heroes, just an available alternative like we had in 15. That’s it.

    The original post called for adding a permanent variation of CS/GA that's locked to troopers only. What you're basically asking for is for DICE to create a duplicate mode that's exactly the same but with no heroes which is not a highly demanded mode. This creation would only serve to split the population of CS/GA players between playing those modes and playing the modes without them. It would be problematic to the success of each modes by leading to less players in both of the modes. It's the same reason why they merged extraction with strike. Both modes had low popularity so they merged them together to increase it as a whole. You'd only get the same result and would ruin the fun of others because of the less likely chance you'll be put in a full session of players.

    BoTG is a perfect middle ground between the two, which is why it's only as an event and also increases traffic. Players can play the mode without the interference of heroes, but the mode goes back to normal following the weekend without splitting the amount of players who play the mode.

    SWBF15 managed to do it and do it well. Many players who enjoyed large mode play without heroes gave up on this game long ago. I’d think providing it would bring players back to the game which would lessen any impact on splitting the player base.

    This isn't BF2015. And, there weren't as many heroes, let alone likable heroes.
    THIS has all been foreseen.
    j2p7umsm2f8x.jpg
  • polarition wrote: »
    polarition wrote: »
    SSJSnoop wrote: »
    You guys reaaaaally want to ruin what little fun there is left in this game.

    Yes, yes they do.

    How is adding a large objective based mode without heroes, as was done in SWBF 15, ruining anyone’s fun? Still would have regular GA/CS with heroes so what’s the problem? Some of us are not looking to remove heroes, just an available alternative like we had in 15. That’s it.

    The original post called for adding a permanent variation of CS/GA that's locked to troopers only. What you're basically asking for is for DICE to create a duplicate mode that's exactly the same but with no heroes which is not a highly demanded mode. This creation would only serve to split the population of CS/GA players between playing those modes and playing the modes without them. It would be problematic to the success of each modes by leading to less players in both of the modes. It's the same reason why they merged extraction with strike. Both modes had low popularity so they merged them together to increase it as a whole. You'd only get the same result and would ruin the fun of others because of the less likely chance you'll be put in a full session of players.

    BoTG is a perfect middle ground between the two, which is why it's only as an event and also increases traffic. Players can play the mode without the interference of heroes, but the mode goes back to normal following the weekend without splitting the amount of players who play the mode.


    I hear your argument that it would reduce player size, but realistically many fewer people will play with the version which includes heroes, than without them - so again we are catering to the minority that finds heroes essential and can only enjoy the game as a hero (again I like them and play them myself, but find separate modes necessary for GA and CS).

    As you said the BotG events causes an uptick in people playing, so you’re technically not losing anything, because you would be gaining people who are otherwise choosing not to play - at least some of which for the reasons already mentioned.

    If not separate modes then maybe they add a universal star card for the trooper classes that lets you pull out the rifle from The Mandalorian to disintegrate them like a Jawa, that’s fair right? One shot kill power abilities are exactly why people use heroes for killstreaks in the first place, right? 😈

    Well, that's more of an assumption, tbh. You can't positively say that people who prefer heroes in the modes are a minority when in reality I could just as easily say they're the majority when you don't have any game statistics to back it up.
    THIS has all been foreseen.
    j2p7umsm2f8x.jpg
  • polarition wrote: »
    polarition wrote: »
    polarition wrote: »
    SSJSnoop wrote: »
    You guys reaaaaally want to ruin what little fun there is left in this game.

    Yes, yes they do.

    How is adding a large objective based mode without heroes, as was done in SWBF 15, ruining anyone’s fun? Still would have regular GA/CS with heroes so what’s the problem? Some of us are not looking to remove heroes, just an available alternative like we had in 15. That’s it.

    The original post called for adding a permanent variation of CS/GA that's locked to troopers only. What you're basically asking for is for DICE to create a duplicate mode that's exactly the same but with no heroes which is not a highly demanded mode. This creation would only serve to split the population of CS/GA players between playing those modes and playing the modes without them. It would be problematic to the success of each modes by leading to less players in both of the modes. It's the same reason why they merged extraction with strike. Both modes had low popularity so they merged them together to increase it as a whole. You'd only get the same result and would ruin the fun of others because of the less likely chance you'll be put in a full session of players.

    BoTG is a perfect middle ground between the two, which is why it's only as an event and also increases traffic. Players can play the mode without the interference of heroes, but the mode goes back to normal following the weekend without splitting the amount of players who play the mode.


    I hear your argument that it would reduce player size, but realistically many fewer people will play with the version which includes heroes, than without them - so again we are catering to the minority that finds heroes essential and can only enjoy the game as a hero (again I like them and play them myself, but find separate modes necessary for GA and CS).

    As you said the BotG events causes an uptick in people playing, so you’re technically not losing anything, because you would be gaining people who are otherwise choosing not to play - at least some of which for the reasons already mentioned.

    If not separate modes then maybe they add a universal star card for the trooper classes that lets you pull out the rifle from The Mandalorian to disintegrate them like a Jawa, that’s fair right? One shot kill power abilities are exactly why people use heroes for killstreaks in the first place, right? 😈

    Well, that's more of an assumption, tbh. You can't positively say that people who prefer heroes in the modes are a minority when in reality I could just as easily say they're the majority when you don't have any game statistics to back it up.

    I would guess most kind of reside in the middle as I do. I’m usually near top of board with or without hero -so I’m not saying take anything away bc I do enjoy it but it’s just more fun if there’s the option to focus on trooper and non-hero strategies in big games as well.
  • PGombi wrote: »
    The "funny" ( <-- sarcasm) thing is, that none of these ideas
    • cooldown timer
    • BP increase
    • reduce amount of heroes
    • queue list
    • undo speeder nerf
    • undo stinger pistol nerf
    • undo supercharged sentry nerf
    • reduce / remove passive HoK
    • etc.
    will ever see the light of day. Every constructive feedback, which could improve balance at the cost of heroes, ends up in DICE's spam filter.

    Because dice isnt interested in making a Battlefront game. They should have renamed the game with that celebration Edition into Heroes Unleashed. I criticized the OP heroes with their non existent limits since the beta... Funny enough the Battlefront 1 Beta featured a timer for heroes... but kids complained and we moved into a more hero dominated Battlefront game. And Battlefront was never meant to be a Hero shooter...but here we are sadly..
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