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Asking Luke to beat the First Order for you is like asking David to beat YOUR Goliath.

Luke was in the trench of the Death Star and was coming up on the "weak point" of the DS. Wedge Antilles and others had already fired their torpedoes to no effect and failed.

Luke switched off his targeting computer to rely solely on the force. The computers told him the details........he was so far away going so fast bla bla bla. On the battlefield David probably looked at Goliath and thought the same thing. It was a mis match. By physics alone he should not win. But David believed that God would deliver Goliath into his hands.

Luke fired his torpedoes guided by the force and they went in, destroying the Death Star. David slang a sling stone at Goliath and it struck Goliath in his temple (weak point) and took the giant down.

Now.... time goes by.......more Death Stars and bases are built..........more bullies and villains appear.

Now imagine seeking out the elderly king David and asking him to come grab his "magic stones" and come fight your battle for you. I imagine that David would have told you that the stones were not magic, it was God and faith that made the difference.

In a similar way, Rey and the resistance sought out Luke Skywalker as he had once destroyed a Death Star. But it was Luke's faith and the force that made the difference. Not magic proton torpedoes. Rey had been chosen and raised up by the force to battle against her generation's evil.

When I first saw TLJ I did question Luke tossing the lightsaber, but it makes sense when you factor in the end of ROTJ when he throws down his saber before Palpatine. Especially right after he took off Vader's hand and saw that he too had a robot hand. Like seeing the pain and war that comes with the sword. In the bible Jesus said all that take up the sword perish by the sword. So it makes sense he would not want to continue. Kind of like Rambo in Rambo 3 when he resist the thought of a new mission and says "my war is over...."

Luke told her common sense......."What did you think was going to happen? That I was going to march in with my laser sword and destroy the entire first order?" That is a mismatch...........its physically impossible. Like when I play Battlefield 4 and see someone up there on the board with 50 kills and 2 deaths. I may have been born at night but it wasn't last night.

But.......the force made the difference for Rey and the resistance. As the Lord made the difference in David's case.

Replies

  • SrawDawg wrote: »
    Luke was in the trench of the Death Star and was coming up on the "weak point" of the DS. Wedge Antilles and others had already fired their torpedoes to no effect and failed.

    Luke switched off his targeting computer to rely solely on the force. The computers told him the details........he was so far away going so fast bla bla bla. On the battlefield David probably looked at Goliath and thought the same thing. It was a mis match. By physics alone he should not win. But David believed that God would deliver Goliath into his hands.

    Luke fired his torpedoes guided by the force and they went in, destroying the Death Star. David slang a sling stone at Goliath and it struck Goliath in his temple (weak point) and took the giant down.

    Now.... time goes by.......more Death Stars and bases are built..........more bullies and villains appear.

    Now imagine seeking out the elderly king David and asking him to come grab his "magic stones" and come fight your battle for you. I imagine that David would have told you that the stones were not magic, it was God and faith that made the difference.

    In a similar way, Rey and the resistance sought out Luke Skywalker as he had once destroyed a Death Star. But it was Luke's faith and the force that made the difference. Not magic proton torpedoes. Rey had been chosen and raised up by the force to battle against her generation's evil.

    When I first saw TLJ I did question Luke tossing the lightsaber, but it makes sense when you factor in the end of ROTJ when he throws down his saber before Palpatine. Especially right after he took off Vader's hand and saw that he too had a robot hand. Like seeing the pain and war that comes with the sword. In the bible Jesus said all that take up the sword perish by the sword. So it makes sense he would not want to continue. Kind of like Rambo in Rambo 3 when he resist the thought of a new mission and says "my war is over...."

    Luke told her common sense......."What did you think was going to happen? That I was going to march in with my laser sword and destroy the entire first order?" That is a mismatch...........its physically impossible. Like when I play Battlefield 4 and see someone up there on the board with 50 kills and 2 deaths. I may have been born at night but it wasn't last night.

    But.......the force made the difference for Rey and the resistance. As the Lord made the difference in David's case.

    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).
  • Metaphorically yes... I suppose, as Luke was effectively taking down a giant with a mere rock.
    TFA-10.7.gif
  • ROMG4
    4700 posts Member
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).

    Naamloos-1.jpg

    ;)
    OOM-9 FOR LEGO STAR WARS
    OOM-9 Hero Concept by AzelfandQuilava
    https://i.redd.it/uleh1g22xrhz.png

    OOM-9 Canonical Material Check-List:

    Star Wars Episode 1: The Phantom Menace
    William Shakespeare's The Phantom of Menace: Star Wars Part the First
    Ultimate Star Wars (Reference Guide)
    Star Wars: On the Front Lines (Reference Guide)
    Darth Maul: "Who is supervising the search for the Gungan cities?" Nute Gunray: "Commander OOM-Nine." Darth Maul: "A droid. The predecessor of your inept B-Ones." Rune Haako: "A superior droid, Lord Maul. Viceroy Gunray's personal guard."
    Bring OOM-9, Hondo, Bo Katan, Mara Jade, Dengar, IG-88, Greedo, Zam Wessel General Veers, Tarkin and Rogue One, into the game we must. The way this is
    Tell Me. Have You Ever Heard Of The Tragedy Of Darth Coyler The Wise?
    A OOM-9 Thread!
    https://battlefront-forums.ea.com/discussion/152598/the-oom-9-vs-jar-jar-season

    Episode 9's Ending
    https://us.v-cdn.net/6025735/uploads/editor/15/zs312vl0xftg.jpeg
  • ROMG4 wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).

    Naamloos-1.jpg

    ;)

    Head canon is the best canon.
  • SrawDawg
    1110 posts Member
    edited March 10
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Luke was in the trench of the Death Star and was coming up on the "weak point" of the DS. Wedge Antilles and others had already fired their torpedoes to no effect and failed.

    Luke switched off his targeting computer to rely solely on the force. The computers told him the details........he was so far away going so fast bla bla bla. On the battlefield David probably looked at Goliath and thought the same thing. It was a mis match. By physics alone he should not win. But David believed that God would deliver Goliath into his hands.

    Luke fired his torpedoes guided by the force and they went in, destroying the Death Star. David slang a sling stone at Goliath and it struck Goliath in his temple (weak point) and took the giant down.

    Now.... time goes by.......more Death Stars and bases are built..........more bullies and villains appear.

    Now imagine seeking out the elderly king David and asking him to come grab his "magic stones" and come fight your battle for you. I imagine that David would have told you that the stones were not magic, it was God and faith that made the difference.

    In a similar way, Rey and the resistance sought out Luke Skywalker as he had once destroyed a Death Star. But it was Luke's faith and the force that made the difference. Not magic proton torpedoes. Rey had been chosen and raised up by the force to battle against her generation's evil.

    When I first saw TLJ I did question Luke tossing the lightsaber, but it makes sense when you factor in the end of ROTJ when he throws down his saber before Palpatine. Especially right after he took off Vader's hand and saw that he too had a robot hand. Like seeing the pain and war that comes with the sword. In the bible Jesus said all that take up the sword perish by the sword. So it makes sense he would not want to continue. Kind of like Rambo in Rambo 3 when he resist the thought of a new mission and says "my war is over...."

    Luke told her common sense......."What did you think was going to happen? That I was going to march in with my laser sword and destroy the entire first order?" That is a mismatch...........its physically impossible. Like when I play Battlefield 4 and see someone up there on the board with 50 kills and 2 deaths. I may have been born at night but it wasn't last night.

    But.......the force made the difference for Rey and the resistance. As the Lord made the difference in David's case.

    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).

    Those Jedi are in the wilderness for a reason...



    And I just recently realized Han Solo is integral to the destruction of all three death stars. Yes I called Starkiller base a Death Star because that is what it is.

    Han appears out of no where and takes out Vader's wingmen and jettisoned Vader into space leaving Luke a clear shot for DS1, took out the endor shield base giving the rebels a chance to destroy DS1, warped under the shield and made Phasma lower shields giving the resistance and its 12 x wing fighters the chance to destroy super massive Star Killer base.
    Post edited by SrawDawg on
  • Cane_danko
    1628 posts Member
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Luke was in the trench of the Death Star and was coming up on the "weak point" of the DS. Wedge Antilles and others had already fired their torpedoes to no effect and failed.

    Luke switched off his targeting computer to rely solely on the force. The computers told him the details........he was so far away going so fast bla bla bla. On the battlefield David probably looked at Goliath and thought the same thing. It was a mis match. By physics alone he should not win. But David believed that God would deliver Goliath into his hands.

    Luke fired his torpedoes guided by the force and they went in, destroying the Death Star. David slang a sling stone at Goliath and it struck Goliath in his temple (weak point) and took the giant down.

    Now.... time goes by.......more Death Stars and bases are built..........more bullies and villains appear.

    Now imagine seeking out the elderly king David and asking him to come grab his "magic stones" and come fight your battle for you. I imagine that David would have told you that the stones were not magic, it was God and faith that made the difference.

    In a similar way, Rey and the resistance sought out Luke Skywalker as he had once destroyed a Death Star. But it was Luke's faith and the force that made the difference. Not magic proton torpedoes. Rey had been chosen and raised up by the force to battle against her generation's evil.

    When I first saw TLJ I did question Luke tossing the lightsaber, but it makes sense when you factor in the end of ROTJ when he throws down his saber before Palpatine. Especially right after he took off Vader's hand and saw that he too had a robot hand. Like seeing the pain and war that comes with the sword. In the bible Jesus said all that take up the sword perish by the sword. So it makes sense he would not want to continue. Kind of like Rambo in Rambo 3 when he resist the thought of a new mission and says "my war is over...."

    Luke told her common sense......."What did you think was going to happen? That I was going to march in with my laser sword and destroy the entire first order?" That is a mismatch...........its physically impossible. Like when I play Battlefield 4 and see someone up there on the board with 50 kills and 2 deaths. I may have been born at night but it wasn't last night.

    But.......the force made the difference for Rey and the resistance. As the Lord made the difference in David's case.

    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).

    Those Jedi are in the wilderness for reason...



    And I just recently realized Han Solo is integral to the destruction of all three death stars. Yes I called Starkiller base a Death Star because that is what it is.

    Han appears out of no where and takes out Vader's wingmen and jettisoned Vader into space leaving Luke a clear shot for DS1, took out the endor shield base giving the rebels a chance to destroy DS1, warped under the shield and made Phasma lower shields giving the resistance and its 12 x wing fighters the chance to destroy super massive Star Killer base.

    He also convinced kylo to turn good in ros and that gave the resistance the edge to beat palpatine who was basically a fleet destroyer.
  • SrawDawg
    1110 posts Member
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Luke was in the trench of the Death Star and was coming up on the "weak point" of the DS. Wedge Antilles and others had already fired their torpedoes to no effect and failed.

    Luke switched off his targeting computer to rely solely on the force. The computers told him the details........he was so far away going so fast bla bla bla. On the battlefield David probably looked at Goliath and thought the same thing. It was a mis match. By physics alone he should not win. But David believed that God would deliver Goliath into his hands.

    Luke fired his torpedoes guided by the force and they went in, destroying the Death Star. David slang a sling stone at Goliath and it struck Goliath in his temple (weak point) and took the giant down.

    Now.... time goes by.......more Death Stars and bases are built..........more bullies and villains appear.

    Now imagine seeking out the elderly king David and asking him to come grab his "magic stones" and come fight your battle for you. I imagine that David would have told you that the stones were not magic, it was God and faith that made the difference.

    In a similar way, Rey and the resistance sought out Luke Skywalker as he had once destroyed a Death Star. But it was Luke's faith and the force that made the difference. Not magic proton torpedoes. Rey had been chosen and raised up by the force to battle against her generation's evil.

    When I first saw TLJ I did question Luke tossing the lightsaber, but it makes sense when you factor in the end of ROTJ when he throws down his saber before Palpatine. Especially right after he took off Vader's hand and saw that he too had a robot hand. Like seeing the pain and war that comes with the sword. In the bible Jesus said all that take up the sword perish by the sword. So it makes sense he would not want to continue. Kind of like Rambo in Rambo 3 when he resist the thought of a new mission and says "my war is over...."

    Luke told her common sense......."What did you think was going to happen? That I was going to march in with my laser sword and destroy the entire first order?" That is a mismatch...........its physically impossible. Like when I play Battlefield 4 and see someone up there on the board with 50 kills and 2 deaths. I may have been born at night but it wasn't last night.

    But.......the force made the difference for Rey and the resistance. As the Lord made the difference in David's case.

    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).

    Those Jedi are in the wilderness for reason...



    And I just recently realized Han Solo is integral to the destruction of all three death stars. Yes I called Starkiller base a Death Star because that is what it is.

    Han appears out of no where and takes out Vader's wingmen and jettisoned Vader into space leaving Luke a clear shot for DS1, took out the endor shield base giving the rebels a chance to destroy DS1, warped under the shield and made Phasma lower shields giving the resistance and its 12 x wing fighters the chance to destroy super massive Star Killer base.

    He also convinced kylo to turn good in ros and that gave the resistance the edge to beat palpatine who was basically a fleet destroyer.

    That is a great point. Had not thought of that. He was always there to provide a strengthening action at just the right moment. Who then could you compare to that action in the prequel trilogy?
  • SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Luke was in the trench of the Death Star and was coming up on the "weak point" of the DS. Wedge Antilles and others had already fired their torpedoes to no effect and failed.

    Luke switched off his targeting computer to rely solely on the force. The computers told him the details........he was so far away going so fast bla bla bla. On the battlefield David probably looked at Goliath and thought the same thing. It was a mis match. By physics alone he should not win. But David believed that God would deliver Goliath into his hands.

    Luke fired his torpedoes guided by the force and they went in, destroying the Death Star. David slang a sling stone at Goliath and it struck Goliath in his temple (weak point) and took the giant down.

    Now.... time goes by.......more Death Stars and bases are built..........more bullies and villains appear.

    Now imagine seeking out the elderly king David and asking him to come grab his "magic stones" and come fight your battle for you. I imagine that David would have told you that the stones were not magic, it was God and faith that made the difference.

    In a similar way, Rey and the resistance sought out Luke Skywalker as he had once destroyed a Death Star. But it was Luke's faith and the force that made the difference. Not magic proton torpedoes. Rey had been chosen and raised up by the force to battle against her generation's evil.

    When I first saw TLJ I did question Luke tossing the lightsaber, but it makes sense when you factor in the end of ROTJ when he throws down his saber before Palpatine. Especially right after he took off Vader's hand and saw that he too had a robot hand. Like seeing the pain and war that comes with the sword. In the bible Jesus said all that take up the sword perish by the sword. So it makes sense he would not want to continue. Kind of like Rambo in Rambo 3 when he resist the thought of a new mission and says "my war is over...."

    Luke told her common sense......."What did you think was going to happen? That I was going to march in with my laser sword and destroy the entire first order?" That is a mismatch...........its physically impossible. Like when I play Battlefield 4 and see someone up there on the board with 50 kills and 2 deaths. I may have been born at night but it wasn't last night.

    But.......the force made the difference for Rey and the resistance. As the Lord made the difference in David's case.

    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).

    Those Jedi are in the wilderness for reason...



    And I just recently realized Han Solo is integral to the destruction of all three death stars. Yes I called Starkiller base a Death Star because that is what it is.

    Han appears out of no where and takes out Vader's wingmen and jettisoned Vader into space leaving Luke a clear shot for DS1, took out the endor shield base giving the rebels a chance to destroy DS1, warped under the shield and made Phasma lower shields giving the resistance and its 12 x wing fighters the chance to destroy super massive Star Killer base.

    He also convinced kylo to turn good in ros and that gave the resistance the edge to beat palpatine who was basically a fleet destroyer.

    That is a great point. Had not thought of that. He was always there to provide a strengthening action at just the right moment. Who then could you compare to that action in the prequel trilogy?

    Well, the prequels have a different dynamic than that of the sequels and ot. It is hard to compare the characters as such. The character dynamic is different but also the fact that the st and ot are stories of redemption while the prequels are ultimately a tragedy. Jar jar and qui gon may be the closest but even they had a much smaller role to play than han who is just as important as luke or rey.
  • SrawDawg
    1110 posts Member
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Luke was in the trench of the Death Star and was coming up on the "weak point" of the DS. Wedge Antilles and others had already fired their torpedoes to no effect and failed.

    Luke switched off his targeting computer to rely solely on the force. The computers told him the details........he was so far away going so fast bla bla bla. On the battlefield David probably looked at Goliath and thought the same thing. It was a mis match. By physics alone he should not win. But David believed that God would deliver Goliath into his hands.

    Luke fired his torpedoes guided by the force and they went in, destroying the Death Star. David slang a sling stone at Goliath and it struck Goliath in his temple (weak point) and took the giant down.

    Now.... time goes by.......more Death Stars and bases are built..........more bullies and villains appear.

    Now imagine seeking out the elderly king David and asking him to come grab his "magic stones" and come fight your battle for you. I imagine that David would have told you that the stones were not magic, it was God and faith that made the difference.

    In a similar way, Rey and the resistance sought out Luke Skywalker as he had once destroyed a Death Star. But it was Luke's faith and the force that made the difference. Not magic proton torpedoes. Rey had been chosen and raised up by the force to battle against her generation's evil.

    When I first saw TLJ I did question Luke tossing the lightsaber, but it makes sense when you factor in the end of ROTJ when he throws down his saber before Palpatine. Especially right after he took off Vader's hand and saw that he too had a robot hand. Like seeing the pain and war that comes with the sword. In the bible Jesus said all that take up the sword perish by the sword. So it makes sense he would not want to continue. Kind of like Rambo in Rambo 3 when he resist the thought of a new mission and says "my war is over...."

    Luke told her common sense......."What did you think was going to happen? That I was going to march in with my laser sword and destroy the entire first order?" That is a mismatch...........its physically impossible. Like when I play Battlefield 4 and see someone up there on the board with 50 kills and 2 deaths. I may have been born at night but it wasn't last night.

    But.......the force made the difference for Rey and the resistance. As the Lord made the difference in David's case.

    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).

    Those Jedi are in the wilderness for reason...



    And I just recently realized Han Solo is integral to the destruction of all three death stars. Yes I called Starkiller base a Death Star because that is what it is.

    Han appears out of no where and takes out Vader's wingmen and jettisoned Vader into space leaving Luke a clear shot for DS1, took out the endor shield base giving the rebels a chance to destroy DS1, warped under the shield and made Phasma lower shields giving the resistance and its 12 x wing fighters the chance to destroy super massive Star Killer base.

    He also convinced kylo to turn good in ros and that gave the resistance the edge to beat palpatine who was basically a fleet destroyer.

    That is a great point. Had not thought of that. He was always there to provide a strengthening action at just the right moment. Who then could you compare to that action in the prequel trilogy?

    Well, the prequels have a different dynamic than that of the sequels and ot. It is hard to compare the characters as such. The character dynamic is different but also the fact that the st and ot are stories of redemption while the prequels are ultimately a tragedy. Jar jar and qui gon may be the closest but even they had a much smaller role to play than han who is just as important as luke or rey.

    Since you put it like that...I guess seeing Qui-Gon go down gave Obi-wan more strength and courage to fight Maul. But given the symmetry of the construction of this franchise, that is interesting to me that the prequels are different in this aspect we are discussing. But then Anakin fired the shot that destroyed the Lukrahulk droid command ship making him like Luke destroying the DS 1. Like a formula that every first and third movie there is a Death Star or something like it. ROTS seems to be the exception of this. But then you could consider Anakin's body as the base or fortress that was destroyed. Does that make sense? What do you think?
  • SrawDawg
    1110 posts Member
    The Jedi temple forgot to add that.
  • SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Luke was in the trench of the Death Star and was coming up on the "weak point" of the DS. Wedge Antilles and others had already fired their torpedoes to no effect and failed.

    Luke switched off his targeting computer to rely solely on the force. The computers told him the details........he was so far away going so fast bla bla bla. On the battlefield David probably looked at Goliath and thought the same thing. It was a mis match. By physics alone he should not win. But David believed that God would deliver Goliath into his hands.

    Luke fired his torpedoes guided by the force and they went in, destroying the Death Star. David slang a sling stone at Goliath and it struck Goliath in his temple (weak point) and took the giant down.

    Now.... time goes by.......more Death Stars and bases are built..........more bullies and villains appear.

    Now imagine seeking out the elderly king David and asking him to come grab his "magic stones" and come fight your battle for you. I imagine that David would have told you that the stones were not magic, it was God and faith that made the difference.

    In a similar way, Rey and the resistance sought out Luke Skywalker as he had once destroyed a Death Star. But it was Luke's faith and the force that made the difference. Not magic proton torpedoes. Rey had been chosen and raised up by the force to battle against her generation's evil.

    When I first saw TLJ I did question Luke tossing the lightsaber, but it makes sense when you factor in the end of ROTJ when he throws down his saber before Palpatine. Especially right after he took off Vader's hand and saw that he too had a robot hand. Like seeing the pain and war that comes with the sword. In the bible Jesus said all that take up the sword perish by the sword. So it makes sense he would not want to continue. Kind of like Rambo in Rambo 3 when he resist the thought of a new mission and says "my war is over...."

    Luke told her common sense......."What did you think was going to happen? That I was going to march in with my laser sword and destroy the entire first order?" That is a mismatch...........its physically impossible. Like when I play Battlefield 4 and see someone up there on the board with 50 kills and 2 deaths. I may have been born at night but it wasn't last night.

    But.......the force made the difference for Rey and the resistance. As the Lord made the difference in David's case.

    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).

    Those Jedi are in the wilderness for reason...



    And I just recently realized Han Solo is integral to the destruction of all three death stars. Yes I called Starkiller base a Death Star because that is what it is.

    Han appears out of no where and takes out Vader's wingmen and jettisoned Vader into space leaving Luke a clear shot for DS1, took out the endor shield base giving the rebels a chance to destroy DS1, warped under the shield and made Phasma lower shields giving the resistance and its 12 x wing fighters the chance to destroy super massive Star Killer base.

    He also convinced kylo to turn good in ros and that gave the resistance the edge to beat palpatine who was basically a fleet destroyer.

    That is a great point. Had not thought of that. He was always there to provide a strengthening action at just the right moment. Who then could you compare to that action in the prequel trilogy?

    Well, the prequels have a different dynamic than that of the sequels and ot. It is hard to compare the characters as such. The character dynamic is different but also the fact that the st and ot are stories of redemption while the prequels are ultimately a tragedy. Jar jar and qui gon may be the closest but even they had a much smaller role to play than han who is just as important as luke or rey.

    Since you put it like that...I guess seeing Qui-Gon go down gave Obi-wan more strength and courage to fight Maul. But given the symmetry of the construction of this franchise, that is interesting to me that the prequels are different in this aspect we are discussing. But then Anakin fired the shot that destroyed the Lukrahulk droid command ship making him like Luke destroying the DS 1. Like a formula that every first and third movie there is a Death Star or something like it. ROTS seems to be the exception of this. But then you could consider Anakin's body as the base or fortress that was destroyed. Does that make sense? What do you think?

    Yeah i would say the jedi temple would be the equivalent of the death star but this time it would be the light losing its ultimate weapon instead of the dark.
  • SrawDawg
    1110 posts Member
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Luke was in the trench of the Death Star and was coming up on the "weak point" of the DS. Wedge Antilles and others had already fired their torpedoes to no effect and failed.

    Luke switched off his targeting computer to rely solely on the force. The computers told him the details........he was so far away going so fast bla bla bla. On the battlefield David probably looked at Goliath and thought the same thing. It was a mis match. By physics alone he should not win. But David believed that God would deliver Goliath into his hands.

    Luke fired his torpedoes guided by the force and they went in, destroying the Death Star. David slang a sling stone at Goliath and it struck Goliath in his temple (weak point) and took the giant down.

    Now.... time goes by.......more Death Stars and bases are built..........more bullies and villains appear.

    Now imagine seeking out the elderly king David and asking him to come grab his "magic stones" and come fight your battle for you. I imagine that David would have told you that the stones were not magic, it was God and faith that made the difference.

    In a similar way, Rey and the resistance sought out Luke Skywalker as he had once destroyed a Death Star. But it was Luke's faith and the force that made the difference. Not magic proton torpedoes. Rey had been chosen and raised up by the force to battle against her generation's evil.

    When I first saw TLJ I did question Luke tossing the lightsaber, but it makes sense when you factor in the end of ROTJ when he throws down his saber before Palpatine. Especially right after he took off Vader's hand and saw that he too had a robot hand. Like seeing the pain and war that comes with the sword. In the bible Jesus said all that take up the sword perish by the sword. So it makes sense he would not want to continue. Kind of like Rambo in Rambo 3 when he resist the thought of a new mission and says "my war is over...."

    Luke told her common sense......."What did you think was going to happen? That I was going to march in with my laser sword and destroy the entire first order?" That is a mismatch...........its physically impossible. Like when I play Battlefield 4 and see someone up there on the board with 50 kills and 2 deaths. I may have been born at night but it wasn't last night.

    But.......the force made the difference for Rey and the resistance. As the Lord made the difference in David's case.

    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).

    Those Jedi are in the wilderness for reason...



    And I just recently realized Han Solo is integral to the destruction of all three death stars. Yes I called Starkiller base a Death Star because that is what it is.

    Han appears out of no where and takes out Vader's wingmen and jettisoned Vader into space leaving Luke a clear shot for DS1, took out the endor shield base giving the rebels a chance to destroy DS1, warped under the shield and made Phasma lower shields giving the resistance and its 12 x wing fighters the chance to destroy super massive Star Killer base.

    He also convinced kylo to turn good in ros and that gave the resistance the edge to beat palpatine who was basically a fleet destroyer.

    That is a great point. Had not thought of that. He was always there to provide a strengthening action at just the right moment. Who then could you compare to that action in the prequel trilogy?

    Well, the prequels have a different dynamic than that of the sequels and ot. It is hard to compare the characters as such. The character dynamic is different but also the fact that the st and ot are stories of redemption while the prequels are ultimately a tragedy. Jar jar and qui gon may be the closest but even they had a much smaller role to play than han who is just as important as luke or rey.

    Since you put it like that...I guess seeing Qui-Gon go down gave Obi-wan more strength and courage to fight Maul. But given the symmetry of the construction of this franchise, that is interesting to me that the prequels are different in this aspect we are discussing. But then Anakin fired the shot that destroyed the Lukrahulk droid command ship making him like Luke destroying the DS 1. Like a formula that every first and third movie there is a Death Star or something like it. ROTS seems to be the exception of this. But then you could consider Anakin's body as the base or fortress that was destroyed. Does that make sense? What do you think?

    Yeah i would say the jedi temple would be the equivalent of the death star but this time it would be the light losing its ultimate weapon instead of the dark.


    Off topic, but who do you think would win a light saber battle between Han Solo and Finn? Assuming Han is in his prime so is Finn.

    Based on what I saw from the films I would say Finn after the way he stood up to Ren and held his own awhile.
  • SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Luke was in the trench of the Death Star and was coming up on the "weak point" of the DS. Wedge Antilles and others had already fired their torpedoes to no effect and failed.

    Luke switched off his targeting computer to rely solely on the force. The computers told him the details........he was so far away going so fast bla bla bla. On the battlefield David probably looked at Goliath and thought the same thing. It was a mis match. By physics alone he should not win. But David believed that God would deliver Goliath into his hands.

    Luke fired his torpedoes guided by the force and they went in, destroying the Death Star. David slang a sling stone at Goliath and it struck Goliath in his temple (weak point) and took the giant down.

    Now.... time goes by.......more Death Stars and bases are built..........more bullies and villains appear.

    Now imagine seeking out the elderly king David and asking him to come grab his "magic stones" and come fight your battle for you. I imagine that David would have told you that the stones were not magic, it was God and faith that made the difference.

    In a similar way, Rey and the resistance sought out Luke Skywalker as he had once destroyed a Death Star. But it was Luke's faith and the force that made the difference. Not magic proton torpedoes. Rey had been chosen and raised up by the force to battle against her generation's evil.

    When I first saw TLJ I did question Luke tossing the lightsaber, but it makes sense when you factor in the end of ROTJ when he throws down his saber before Palpatine. Especially right after he took off Vader's hand and saw that he too had a robot hand. Like seeing the pain and war that comes with the sword. In the bible Jesus said all that take up the sword perish by the sword. So it makes sense he would not want to continue. Kind of like Rambo in Rambo 3 when he resist the thought of a new mission and says "my war is over...."

    Luke told her common sense......."What did you think was going to happen? That I was going to march in with my laser sword and destroy the entire first order?" That is a mismatch...........its physically impossible. Like when I play Battlefield 4 and see someone up there on the board with 50 kills and 2 deaths. I may have been born at night but it wasn't last night.

    But.......the force made the difference for Rey and the resistance. As the Lord made the difference in David's case.

    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).

    Those Jedi are in the wilderness for reason...



    And I just recently realized Han Solo is integral to the destruction of all three death stars. Yes I called Starkiller base a Death Star because that is what it is.

    Han appears out of no where and takes out Vader's wingmen and jettisoned Vader into space leaving Luke a clear shot for DS1, took out the endor shield base giving the rebels a chance to destroy DS1, warped under the shield and made Phasma lower shields giving the resistance and its 12 x wing fighters the chance to destroy super massive Star Killer base.

    He also convinced kylo to turn good in ros and that gave the resistance the edge to beat palpatine who was basically a fleet destroyer.

    That is a great point. Had not thought of that. He was always there to provide a strengthening action at just the right moment. Who then could you compare to that action in the prequel trilogy?

    Well, the prequels have a different dynamic than that of the sequels and ot. It is hard to compare the characters as such. The character dynamic is different but also the fact that the st and ot are stories of redemption while the prequels are ultimately a tragedy. Jar jar and qui gon may be the closest but even they had a much smaller role to play than han who is just as important as luke or rey.

    Since you put it like that...I guess seeing Qui-Gon go down gave Obi-wan more strength and courage to fight Maul. But given the symmetry of the construction of this franchise, that is interesting to me that the prequels are different in this aspect we are discussing. But then Anakin fired the shot that destroyed the Lukrahulk droid command ship making him like Luke destroying the DS 1. Like a formula that every first and third movie there is a Death Star or something like it. ROTS seems to be the exception of this. But then you could consider Anakin's body as the base or fortress that was destroyed. Does that make sense? What do you think?

    Yeah i would say the jedi temple would be the equivalent of the death star but this time it would be the light losing its ultimate weapon instead of the dark.


    Off topic, but who do you think would win a light saber battle between Han Solo and Finn? Assuming Han is in his prime so is Finn.

    Based on what I saw from the films I would say Finn after the way he stood up to Ren and held his own awhile.

    In the eu finn was the second best in his class for melee combat. The tr8r guy was the first. I pick finn. In a gun fight han would own him though.
  • SrawDawg
    1110 posts Member
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Cane_danko wrote: »
    SrawDawg wrote: »
    Luke was in the trench of the Death Star and was coming up on the "weak point" of the DS. Wedge Antilles and others had already fired their torpedoes to no effect and failed.

    Luke switched off his targeting computer to rely solely on the force. The computers told him the details........he was so far away going so fast bla bla bla. On the battlefield David probably looked at Goliath and thought the same thing. It was a mis match. By physics alone he should not win. But David believed that God would deliver Goliath into his hands.

    Luke fired his torpedoes guided by the force and they went in, destroying the Death Star. David slang a sling stone at Goliath and it struck Goliath in his temple (weak point) and took the giant down.

    Now.... time goes by.......more Death Stars and bases are built..........more bullies and villains appear.

    Now imagine seeking out the elderly king David and asking him to come grab his "magic stones" and come fight your battle for you. I imagine that David would have told you that the stones were not magic, it was God and faith that made the difference.

    In a similar way, Rey and the resistance sought out Luke Skywalker as he had once destroyed a Death Star. But it was Luke's faith and the force that made the difference. Not magic proton torpedoes. Rey had been chosen and raised up by the force to battle against her generation's evil.

    When I first saw TLJ I did question Luke tossing the lightsaber, but it makes sense when you factor in the end of ROTJ when he throws down his saber before Palpatine. Especially right after he took off Vader's hand and saw that he too had a robot hand. Like seeing the pain and war that comes with the sword. In the bible Jesus said all that take up the sword perish by the sword. So it makes sense he would not want to continue. Kind of like Rambo in Rambo 3 when he resist the thought of a new mission and says "my war is over...."

    Luke told her common sense......."What did you think was going to happen? That I was going to march in with my laser sword and destroy the entire first order?" That is a mismatch...........its physically impossible. Like when I play Battlefield 4 and see someone up there on the board with 50 kills and 2 deaths. I may have been born at night but it wasn't last night.

    But.......the force made the difference for Rey and the resistance. As the Lord made the difference in David's case.

    I mean, i don’t really get into the religious aspect of what you are saying but i do agree with the sentiment. Luke was done saving the galaxy. In any universe, the impact of everything that luke had done in his life had to take a toll. Not only was he responsible for killing everyone in death star 1 but he turned around and helped them do the same thing to death star 2. All those lives were lost because of him. Sure it was heroic. But not long after it was by his actions that led to the first order and thus the cycle of death continued. We all had this idealized version of luke in our heads as did the resistance. No one ever stopped to think what being the galaxies ultimate hero must be like for him. I imagine it to be a lonely state where everyone is superficially praising the fact that you wiped out hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of politics. Hubris also comes into play as luke thought his new order of jedi would fix all the problems of the old order. It backfired in a serious way and i am sure by that point luke was ready to call it. Suicide would be an option but i see why he would just choose to isolate himself rather than giving in completely to the dark side (which i am sure suicide would be).

    Those Jedi are in the wilderness for reason...



    And I just recently realized Han Solo is integral to the destruction of all three death stars. Yes I called Starkiller base a Death Star because that is what it is.

    Han appears out of no where and takes out Vader's wingmen and jettisoned Vader into space leaving Luke a clear shot for DS1, took out the endor shield base giving the rebels a chance to destroy DS1, warped under the shield and made Phasma lower shields giving the resistance and its 12 x wing fighters the chance to destroy super massive Star Killer base.

    He also convinced kylo to turn good in ros and that gave the resistance the edge to beat palpatine who was basically a fleet destroyer.

    That is a great point. Had not thought of that. He was always there to provide a strengthening action at just the right moment. Who then could you compare to that action in the prequel trilogy?

    Well, the prequels have a different dynamic than that of the sequels and ot. It is hard to compare the characters as such. The character dynamic is different but also the fact that the st and ot are stories of redemption while the prequels are ultimately a tragedy. Jar jar and qui gon may be the closest but even they had a much smaller role to play than han who is just as important as luke or rey.

    Since you put it like that...I guess seeing Qui-Gon go down gave Obi-wan more strength and courage to fight Maul. But given the symmetry of the construction of this franchise, that is interesting to me that the prequels are different in this aspect we are discussing. But then Anakin fired the shot that destroyed the Lukrahulk droid command ship making him like Luke destroying the DS 1. Like a formula that every first and third movie there is a Death Star or something like it. ROTS seems to be the exception of this. But then you could consider Anakin's body as the base or fortress that was destroyed. Does that make sense? What do you think?

    Yeah i would say the jedi temple would be the equivalent of the death star but this time it would be the light losing its ultimate weapon instead of the dark.


    Off topic, but who do you think would win a light saber battle between Han Solo and Finn? Assuming Han is in his prime so is Finn.

    Based on what I saw from the films I would say Finn after the way he stood up to Ren and held his own awhile.

    In the eu finn was the second best in his class for melee combat. The tr8r guy was the first. I pick finn. In a gun fight han would own him though.

    I agree with that.
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