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Anakin should be more of a glass cannon

2

Replies

  • TheHammer505
    131 posts Member
    edited April 13
    Deckard112 wrote: »
    https://battlefront-forums.ea.com/discussion/134583/my-thoughts-on-anakin-nerf-suggestion#latest

    & there you go a anakin nerf suggestion that isn't bad. More people should actually try to balance him & not nerf him into the ground. My suggestions are better than a lot of people who have some crazy hate for him

    Yes, I've read it already. And it's not even that I hate Anakin. I love him as a character, but that doesn't mean he should be drastically more powerful than the competition. So you're telling me that you would be 100% fine with Vader and Kylo having 1000 HP, 165 saber damage, and 4 abilities (3 of which involve CC)?

    I would be fine with vader having 1000 hp & doing 165 damage with focus rage active yes. Kylo just needs pull to be on a shorter cooldown & a 4th ability is unique to anakin but I wouldn't mind if kylo had a 360 degree freeze that's stops blaster fire & enemies. More heroes shouldbe like him he shouldn't be like the rest seeing as how most saber users can't even take on 2 officers yet anakin can

    But why should Anakin even have a 4th ability at all? Let alone one that can immobilize multiple targets at once WHILE dealing damage to them.

    Why shouldn't anakin have a,4th ability. Go ahead & say because everyone else don't have one. He's keeping it get used to it

    Lol got your little fanboy panties all in a wad. Chill out dude. And yes, that's exactly why he shouldn't have one. Now your turn to tell me why he should have one :)

    No not really. Stating a fact. They're not getting rid of it. They have no intention of removing it. Well this isn't exactly word for word but dice said " to signify the fact that he's the chosen one he has a 4th ability blase blah.

    Like I said. No answer. A lot of blah blah.

    The ultimate ability was something we wanted to do specifically for Anakin to signify the Chosen One while at his best.

    Boom. A devs comment on why anakin has a fourth ability. Lmao I'll be waiting

    Weird. I don't recall asking about the dev's reason as to why he has 4 abilities. I asked for your reasoning. And if all you're gonna do is throw out the "He's the Chosen One" excuse then that's a pretty lame excuse. And the "at his best" part of that excuse is laughably vague. Let's be honest here, Anakin did have the most potential as far as Force Users go. Key word: potential. Anakin never lived up to that potential as a Jedi. He tossed his Force Powers to the side and focused more on his lightsaber combat. That's not to say that his Force Powers were weak, they just weren't nearly as developed as they should have been (Remember that Obi-wan Kenobi matched his Force Push). Anakin wasn't some Force juggernaut who destroyed a battlefield with ridiculous Force Powers. And as I said earlier, the Force Power on which Retribution is based was only used once. And it was on Mortis, which acted as a Force conduit and increased his power beyond what he was capable of normally. I personally think they should just rework him entirely to be the power duelist that he actually was. Keep Passionate Strike and Pull Dominance. Can the others.
  • https://battlefront-forums.ea.com/discussion/134583/my-thoughts-on-anakin-nerf-suggestion#latest

    & there you go a anakin nerf suggestion that isn't bad. More people should actually try to balance him & not nerf him into the ground. My suggestions are better than a lot of people who have some crazy hate for him

    Yes, I've read it already. And it's not even that I hate Anakin. I love him as a character, but that doesn't mean he should be drastically more powerful than the competition. So you're telling me that you would be 100% fine with Vader and Kylo having 1000 HP, 165 saber damage, and 4 abilities (3 of which involve CC)?

    I would be fine with vader having 1000 hp & doing 165 damage with focus rage active yes. Kylo just needs pull to be on a shorter cooldown & a 4th ability is unique to anakin but I wouldn't mind if kylo had a 360 degree freeze that's stops blaster fire & enemies. More heroes shouldbe like him he shouldn't be like the rest seeing as how most saber users can't even take on 2 officers yet anakin can

    But why should Anakin even have a 4th ability at all? Let alone one that can immobilize multiple targets at once WHILE dealing damage to them.
    Deckard112 wrote: »
    https://battlefront-forums.ea.com/discussion/134583/my-thoughts-on-anakin-nerf-suggestion#latest

    & there you go a anakin nerf suggestion that isn't bad. More people should actually try to balance him & not nerf him into the ground. My suggestions are better than a lot of people who have some crazy hate for him

    Yes, I've read it already. And it's not even that I hate Anakin. I love him as a character, but that doesn't mean he should be drastically more powerful than the competition. So you're telling me that you would be 100% fine with Vader and Kylo having 1000 HP, 165 saber damage, and 4 abilities (3 of which involve CC)?

    I would be fine with vader having 1000 hp & doing 165 damage with focus rage active yes. Kylo just needs pull to be on a shorter cooldown & a 4th ability is unique to anakin but I wouldn't mind if kylo had a 360 degree freeze that's stops blaster fire & enemies. More heroes shouldbe like him he shouldn't be like the rest seeing as how most saber users can't even take on 2 officers yet anakin can

    But why should Anakin even have a 4th ability at all? Let alone one that can immobilize multiple targets at once WHILE dealing damage to them.

    Why shouldn't anakin have a,4th ability. Go ahead & say because everyone else don't have one. He's keeping it get used to it

    Lol got your little fanboy panties all in a wad. Chill out dude. And yes, that's exactly why he shouldn't have one. Now your turn to tell me why he should have one :)

    No not really. Stating a fact. They're not getting rid of it. They have no intention of removing it. Well this isn't exactly word for word but dice said " to signify the fact that he's the chosen one he has a 4th ability blase blah.

    Like I said. No answer. A lot of blah blah.

    The ultimate ability was something we wanted to do specifically for Anakin to signify the Chosen One while at his best.

    Boom. A devs comment on why anakin has a fourth ability. Lmao I'll be waiting

    Weird. I don't recall asking about the dev's reason as to why he has 4 abilities. I asked for your reasoning. And if all you're gonna do is throw out the "He's the Chosen One" excuse then that's a pretty lame excuse.

    You didn't really ask me. You didn't ask about the devs or mines really. I think anakin should have a 4th ability because it spices things up & makes him unique compared to the other characters. Dooku has 3 dodges as well as infiltrators should they only have 2 because everyone else have 2 as well. boba, iden, & Leia have 4 abilities. Also if you're gonna throw out because everyone else doesn't have one it's a lame excuse just as much as cause he's the chosen one. Dooku has a 3rd dodge to signify he's a exquisite duelist & anakin has a 4th ability mainly because he's the chosen one. Soooo no matter how much you hate it those are the reasons
  • https://battlefront-forums.ea.com/discussion/134583/my-thoughts-on-anakin-nerf-suggestion#latest

    & there you go a anakin nerf suggestion that isn't bad. More people should actually try to balance him & not nerf him into the ground. My suggestions are better than a lot of people who have some crazy hate for him

    Yes, I've read it already. And it's not even that I hate Anakin. I love him as a character, but that doesn't mean he should be drastically more powerful than the competition. So you're telling me that you would be 100% fine with Vader and Kylo having 1000 HP, 165 saber damage, and 4 abilities (3 of which involve CC)?

    I would be fine with vader having 1000 hp & doing 165 damage with focus rage active yes. Kylo just needs pull to be on a shorter cooldown & a 4th ability is unique to anakin but I wouldn't mind if kylo had a 360 degree freeze that's stops blaster fire & enemies. More heroes shouldbe like him he shouldn't be like the rest seeing as how most saber users can't even take on 2 officers yet anakin can

    But why should Anakin even have a 4th ability at all? Let alone one that can immobilize multiple targets at once WHILE dealing damage to them.
    Deckard112 wrote: »
    https://battlefront-forums.ea.com/discussion/134583/my-thoughts-on-anakin-nerf-suggestion#latest

    & there you go a anakin nerf suggestion that isn't bad. More people should actually try to balance him & not nerf him into the ground. My suggestions are better than a lot of people who have some crazy hate for him

    Yes, I've read it already. And it's not even that I hate Anakin. I love him as a character, but that doesn't mean he should be drastically more powerful than the competition. So you're telling me that you would be 100% fine with Vader and Kylo having 1000 HP, 165 saber damage, and 4 abilities (3 of which involve CC)?

    I would be fine with vader having 1000 hp & doing 165 damage with focus rage active yes. Kylo just needs pull to be on a shorter cooldown & a 4th ability is unique to anakin but I wouldn't mind if kylo had a 360 degree freeze that's stops blaster fire & enemies. More heroes shouldbe like him he shouldn't be like the rest seeing as how most saber users can't even take on 2 officers yet anakin can

    But why should Anakin even have a 4th ability at all? Let alone one that can immobilize multiple targets at once WHILE dealing damage to them.

    Why shouldn't anakin have a,4th ability. Go ahead & say because everyone else don't have one. He's keeping it get used to it

    Lol got your little fanboy panties all in a wad. Chill out dude. And yes, that's exactly why he shouldn't have one. Now your turn to tell me why he should have one :)

    No not really. Stating a fact. They're not getting rid of it. They have no intention of removing it. Well this isn't exactly word for word but dice said " to signify the fact that he's the chosen one he has a 4th ability blase blah.

    Like I said. No answer. A lot of blah blah.

    The ultimate ability was something we wanted to do specifically for Anakin to signify the Chosen One while at his best.

    Boom. A devs comment on why anakin has a fourth ability. Lmao I'll be waiting

    Weird. I don't recall asking about the dev's reason as to why he has 4 abilities. I asked for your reasoning. And if all you're gonna do is throw out the "He's the Chosen One" excuse then that's a pretty lame excuse.

    You didn't really ask me. You didn't ask about the devs or mines really. I think anakin should have a 4th ability because it spices things up & makes him unique compared to the other characters. Dooku has 3 dodges as well as infiltrators should they only have 2 because everyone else have 2 as well. boba, iden, & Leia have 4 abilities. Also if you're gonna throw out because everyone else doesn't have one it's a lame excuse just as much as cause he's the chosen one. Dooku has a 3rd dodge to signify he's a exquisite duelist & anakin has a 4th ability mainly because he's the chosen one. Soooo no matter how much you hate it those are the reasons

    Right. Well I edited my previous comment to include more detail as to my stance on things. Refer back to that please
  • You already conceded earlier, you are just here trying to save face for exposing your own bias and rigidity.
    I conceded nothing. I'm afraid theres little here for me to save face about. Instead it seems your argument is crumbling and rather than address it you'd casually like to reframe the entire premise into a petty argumentative bout that you think you have a better chance at winning. You're incorrect, suffice to say.

    Your arguments are filled with logical fallacies and that demonstrates that your attempt at logic is only damaging your narrative.
    My arguments are either just incomprehensible to you, or you're just intentionally evading them. Thats the only thing I can say that's black and white here. I'm afraid such a simple matter like this has more to do with common sense than logic. You've yet to directly address my narrative let alone make a reasonable counterpoint, something tells me you simply don't have one, and will continue to talk in circles.

    Make a point, or address one of mine. It really isn't that hard.
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  • You already conceded earlier, you are just here trying to save face for exposing your own bias and rigidity.
    I conceded nothing. I'm afraid theres little here for me to save face about. Instead it seems your argument is crumbling and rather than address it you'd casually like to reframe the entire premise into a petty argumentative bout that you think you have a better chance at winning. You're incorrect, suffice to say.

    Your arguments are filled with logical fallacies and that demonstrates that your attempt at logic is only damaging your narrative.
    My arguments are either just incomprehensible to you, or you're just intentionally evading them. Thats the only thing I can say that's black and white here. I'm afraid such a simple matter like this has more to do with common sense than logic. You've yet to directly address my narrative let alone make a reasonable counterpoint, something tells me you simply don't have one, and will continue to talk in circles.

    Make a point, or address one of mine. It really isn't that hard.

    Lol you literally just made no point.

    I have made my arguments (that Luke is bad in GA for a combination of reasons + that Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed)), rebutted all of yours (that Luke being bad in GA isn't just because he has lower Regen + that Anakin would be UP with nerfed HP stats). You are merely repeating yourself at this stage after I dismantled your biased arguments.

    It's clear you are just trying to distract from the core point that Anakin's HP stats are OP by being fixated on just his regen.

    You already conceded that Anakin's HP stats are OP, add on to your argument because there's nothing left to rebut at this point.
    hnytpwosbe30.png
  • You already conceded earlier, you are just here trying to save face for exposing your own bias and rigidity.
    I conceded nothing. I'm afraid theres little here for me to save face about. Instead it seems your argument is crumbling and rather than address it you'd casually like to reframe the entire premise into a petty argumentative bout that you think you have a better chance at winning. You're incorrect, suffice to say.

    Your arguments are filled with logical fallacies and that demonstrates that your attempt at logic is only damaging your narrative.
    My arguments are either just incomprehensible to you, or you're just intentionally evading them. Thats the only thing I can say that's black and white here. I'm afraid such a simple matter like this has more to do with common sense than logic. You've yet to directly address my narrative let alone make a reasonable counterpoint, something tells me you simply don't have one, and will continue to talk in circles.

    Make a point, or address one of mine. It really isn't that hard.

    Exactly. He’s not really making his argument convincing.
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  • GenxDarchi wrote: »
    Exactly. He’s not really making his argument convincing.
    You're also being fallacious by not backing up your claim that my argument isn't convincing- it's a logical fallacy called begging the question.

    Provide the specifics on what you don't find convincing, so there is actually something to address.

    I already made my points, addressed and rebutted his...

    My point:
    1. Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed
    2. Luke is bad in GA for a combination of reasons

    His counter-point:
    1. Anakin would be UP with nerfed HP stats
    2. Luke is bad in GA mostly because he has lower Regen

    My rebuttal:
    1. Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest damage
    2. Luke is bad in GA because of several reasons such as weak abilities, low damage, poor health stats, etc- it is fallacious to claim that Luke is mostly bad in GA because he has low regen as it's clearly not a black or white situation as shown above and he hasn't provided any data that demonstrates that Luke is bad in GA mainly because his low regen.

    He has already conceded that Anakin's HP stats are OP, what is there left to convince or rebut?


    hnytpwosbe30.png
  • GenxDarchi wrote: »
    Exactly. He’s not really making his argument convincing.
    You're also being fallacious by not backing up your claim that my argument isn't convincing- it's a logical fallacy called begging the question.

    Provide the specifics on what you don't find convincing, so there is actually something to address.

    I already made my points, addressed and rebutted his...

    My point:
    1. Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed
    2. Luke is bad in GA for a combination of reasons

    His counter-point:
    1. Anakin would be UP with nerfed HP stats
    2. Luke is bad in GA mostly because he has lower Regen

    My rebuttal:
    1. Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest damage
    2. Luke is bad in GA because of several reasons such as weak abilities, low damage, poor health stats, etc- it is fallacious to claim that Luke is mostly bad in GA because he has low regen as it's clearly not a black or white situation as shown above and he hasn't provided any data that demonstrates that Luke is bad in GA mainly because his low regen.

    He has already conceded that Anakin's HP stats are OP, what is there left to convince or rebut?


    No lightsaber hero should have 200 regen especially now everyone has been buffed. Anakins health isn't op how is it gonna be op when he has just 50 hp more than vader. Is vaders hp op as Well? I don't mind if anakins health is 700 if he had 300 regen or 320 yet you really think hey his health is a main issue when it's not. Fix retribution, fix heroic might, fix passionate strike & he's fine.
  • No lightsaber hero should have 200 regen especially now everyone has been buffed. Anakins health isn't op how is it gonna be op when he has just 50 hp more than vader. Is vaders hp op as Well? I don't mind if anakins health is 700 if he had 300 regen or 320 yet you really think hey his health is a main issue when it's not. Fix retribution, fix heroic might, fix passionate strike & he's fine.

    Lol your bias is so blinding. How can anyone take you seriously when you are trying to claim Anakin's HP stats aren't OP. You are trying the minimization tactic by trying to suggest that being 50 more than Vader is insignificant. He has the best HP stats by far, that makes him OP on top of having the best abilities and damage.

    His abilities are already getting nerfed (I'd argue they can be nerfed a bit further besides pull), but his HP stats aren't being touched as of yet when they are one of the main reasons he's OP. Literally why he is so difficult to kill.

    50 more really is insignificant. No as I said I don't mind his health being nerfed or his abilities. What isn't a problem is his health. Is vader hp op? No it's not. Goodness the reason anakin is hard to kill is because of his abilities & cooldowns not because of his hp. No bias it's just the truth. Your bias against anakin is blinding.
  • AbyssWatch3r
    4974 posts Member
    edited April 13
    I rebutted all of yours
    Not even close. But Let's go ahead and break this down yet again.
    Luke being bad in GA isn't just because he has lower Regen
    That was never my argument, please, don't twist my words. I'll repeat myself once more, just for you. I'm saying by in large, the most significant aspect that makes luke bad in GA is HP regen. His star cards and Repulse hit detection are tertiary, and less relevant aspects.

    We see this trend in other Heroes as well like Grevious and dooku where it's not so much hit detection that renders their abilities useless but the actual poor utility of using them on the battlefield, netting the same overall result. Theres countless other abilities that also meet this criteria.

    Next.
    + that Anakin would be UP with nerfed HP stats). You are merely repeating yourself at this stage after I dismantled your biased arguments.
    With 700 HP, a 200 damage threshold, and even slower regen speed It's doesn't take a genius to figure that Anakins stats would be worse on paper than one of the worst saber Heroes in the game for (GA). Also lacking that characters speed and mobility to get away just further exasperates an already know problem.

    He would just hemorrhage HP if he ever attempted to fight outside of using his pull and abilities, and wouldn't even have the mobility to get away, as haphazard of a tactic that already is. Again having to solely rely on a characters abilities to carry them isn't balanced. It's part of why kylo and boba weren't balanced in GA at launch either.

    Next.
    It's clear you are just trying to distract from the core point that Anakin's HP stats are OP by being fixated on just his regen.
    His Hp Stats are 800 HP, and 250 regen with the default regen speed that everybody but luke has. Sorry, but I don't see whats OP about that. Maybe you should re-evaluate your argument, because on the face of it, it's simply irrational. Keep in mind your initial post said touching his abilities would be "nerfing the wrong things" so I'd like to assume you have no problem with his abilities being they way they are, though I personally disagree.

    Next.
    You already conceded that Anakin's HP stats are OP, add on to your argument because there's nothing left to rebut at this point.
    You're imagining things. John. Nowhere did I concede anything to you, it's simply a figment of your imagination that you evidently like repeating. No matter how many times you claim this, I'll still just swat it away.

    At this rate you must be dizzy talking in circles and repeating yourself, how about you change course, and again.
    Make a point, or address one of mine, It's not hard.
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  • johnmangala
    491 posts Member
    edited April 13
    Not even close. But Let's go ahead and break this down yet again.

    That was never my argument, please, don't twist my words. I'll repeat myself once more, just for you. I'm saying by in large, the most significant aspect that makes luke bad in GA is HP regen. His star cards and Repulse hit detection are tertiary, and less relevant aspects.

    We see this trend in other Heroes as well like Grevious and dooku where it's not so much hit detection that renders their abilities useless but the actual poor utility of using them on the battlefield, netting the same overall result. Theres countless other abilities that also meet this criteria.
    I already addressed this. You have not shown any data that shows his regen is the most significant reason that Luke is bad in GA. You are committing a fallacy called begging the question again.
    Next.

    With 700 HP, a 200 damage threshold, and even slower regen speed It's doesn't take a genius to figure that Anakins stats would be worse on paper than one of the worst saber Heroes in the game for (GA). Also lacking that characters speed and mobility to get away just further exasperate an already know problem.

    He would just hemorrhage HP if he ever attempted to fight outside of using his pull and abilities, and wouldn't even have the mobility to get away, as haphazard of a tactic that already is. Again having to sole rely on a characters abilities to carry them isn't balanced. It's part of why kylo and boba weren't balanced in GA at launch either.
    Again you fail to acknowledge that Luke is bad in GA for a combination of reasons whereas Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest damage.
    Next.

    His Hp Stats are 800 HP, and 250 regen with the default regen speed that everybody but luke has. Sorry, but I don't see whats OP about that. Maybe you should re-evaluate your argument, because on the face of it, it's simply irrational. Keep in mind your initial post said touching his abilities would be "nerfing the wrong things" so I'd like to assume you have no problem with his abilities being they way they are, though I personally disagree.
    Clearly you are continuing to demonstrate your lack of comprehension skills. When I said they are nerfing the wrong things I specified them nerfing his pull range.
    Next.

    You're imagining things. John. Nowhere did I concede anything to you, it's simply a figment of your imagination that you evidently like repeating. No matter how many times you claim this, I'll still just swat it away.

    At this rate you must be dizzy talking in circles and repeating yourself, how about you change course, and again.
    Make a point, or address one of mine, It's not hard.
    You indeed already conceded that his his HP stats are inflated when you stated, "You want to talk about his other stats? Fine." Which suggests you are fine with possibly nerfing his other HP stats. I already showed you being hung up on the regen is only distracting from the core point and that is another logical fallacy known as a red herring.

    Either directly address my core point or move on. Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed.
    hnytpwosbe30.png
  • AbyssWatch3r
    4974 posts Member
    edited April 13
    I already addressed this. You have not shown any data that shows his regen is the most significant reason that Luke is bad in GA. You are committing a fallacy called begging the question again.
    I'm afraid you have a limited grasp of just what "begging the question is". I gave ample "evidence" as to why luke is primarily held back by his low regen. His push and rush attack aren't the issue at all, they have the same hit detection and traits like any other comparable force ability.

    Rather it's his repulse thats not up to par as often times targets can walk through it and the slightest terrain blocks it, unlike Anakins Heroic Might, mauls choke, ect. On top of it hits for low damage and leaves him quite vulnerable. Effectively he has one more or less useless ability in GA.

    Other Saber Heroes suffer from this as well. For example, Dooku's expose weakness and Grevious Unrelenting Advance are not user friendly abilities either in GA and are often more detrimental than not to use against troopers, they too are by in large useless. However with effectively higher regen than luke they can still do decently well. If we look at dooku in particular Lukes Force push is an objectively better ability against infantry while one could argue Duelist is better than Lukes rush. Effectively I'd say it's a draw in terms of who has the better abilities as they both have their merits, but we(and others) can clearly agree Dooku is better than Luke simply because he has higher regen and doesn't take as much permanent damage. Ergo my argument.

    If you can't follow this train of thought it's your reading comprehension thats at fault here. Not mine. Next.
    Again you fail to acknowledge that Luke is bad in GA for a combination of reasons whereas Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest damage.
    I failed to do no such thing, rather you evade my argument entirely and cling on to this false narrative that I somehow haven't acknowledged what I actually wen't to great lengths to explain. Really this is your own red herring, and hypocrisy at it's finest.

    In addition, by what metric do we judge an ability as "the best"? Theres plenty of other abilities that other Heroes Have that I would much rather Have on Anakin, and even vice versa. You yourself are committing the logical fallacy of begging the question as well, it really is both Ironic and comical. Highest Damage? I think you've gotta be a little more specific, theres plenty of abilities that out damage Aspects of Anakin. Might want to flesh this point out a little.

    Clearly you are continuing to demonstrate your lack of comprehension skills. When I said they are nerfing the wrong things I specified them nerfing his pull range.
    And yet you didn't mention nerfing any of his other abilities like Heroic Might or his retribution, instead you insisted the more important thing was nerfing his "HP and Regen" significantly. His pull range also encompasses his "abilities" like I said so it isn't so much comprehension on my end, but more or less nuance in you're post. If you're not precluding his other abilities from being nerfed, especially in a vague manner then it's on you to make it explicitly clear. You might wan't to do some introspection, because it's not my comprehension skills that are in question. Thanks.
    You indeed already conceded that his his HP stats are inflated when you stated, "You want to talk about his other stats? Fine." Which suggests you are fine with possibly nerfing his other HP stats. I already showed you being hung up on the regen is only distracting from the core point and that is another logical fallacy known as a red herring.
    Now you're the one drawing a false conclusion here, you spoke of my comprehension skills when I drew a reasonable inference from your original post, and yet you do it here as well but with an obviously warped bent. You can't have it both ways, johnny, so please, thoroughly read with context next time.

    In near the same breath, my exact quote was "I'll repeat again, 200 regen, on any melee hero is a broken concept, it's unbalanced and with just 700 HP it would render anakin bottom tier" Clearly I'm saying his actual HP is fine at 800, and you nerfing it by a 100 would be unbalanced. Again, I'm not "distracting" from anything and made it clear where I stand from the very beginning.

    I'm afraid it's you who's committing most of the logical fallacies here if anything, red herring? Please, don't make me laugh. You keep on regurgitating the same warped arguments over and over again in an obvious bid to reframe my argument into something you have a chance of beating, It's clear as day.

    Either directly address my core point or move on. Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed.

    I already did. Simply put, your stat changes would break anakin, and make him underpowered. I'm not interested in repeating why. It's now up to you if you're going to comprehend this, or continue in this form of inanity and dredge up those go-to talking points of yours.
    Post edited by AbyssWatch3r on
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  • I'm afraid you have a limited grasp of just what "begging the question is". I gave ample "evidence" as to why luke is primarily held back by his low regen. His push and rush attack aren't the issue at all, they have the same hit detection and traits like any other comparable force ability.

    Rather it's his repulse thats not up to par as often times targets can walk through it and the slightest terrain blocks it, unlike Anakins Heroic Might, mauls choke, ect. On top of it hits for low damage and leaves him quite vulnerable. Effectively he has one more or less useless ability in GA.

    Other Saber Heroes suffer from this as well. For example, Dooku's expose weakness and Grevious Unrelenting Advance are not user friendly abilities either in GA and are often more detrimental than not to use against troopers, they too are by in large useless. However with effectively higher regen than luke they can still do decently well. If we look at dooku in particular Lukes Force push is an objectively better ability against infantry while one could argue Duelist is better than Lukes rush. Effectively I'd say it's a draw in terms of who has the better abilities as they both have their merits, but we(and others) can clearly agree Dooku is better than Luke simply because he has higher regen and doesn't take as much permanent damage. Ergo my argument.

    If you can't follow this train of thought it's your reading comprehension thats at fault here. Not mine. Next.
    You did not support your claim. Claiming Luke is primarily held back by his regen requires actual data like how it's in proportion with the other reasons he is bad in GA. Something you haven't provided.

    I failed to do no such thing, rather you evade my argument entirely and cling on to this false narrative that I somehow haven't acknowledged what I actually wen't to great lengths to explain. Really this is your own red herring, and hypocrisy at it's finest.

    In addition, by what metric do we judge an ability as "the best"? Theres plenty of other abilities that other Heroes Have that I would much rather Have on Anakin, and even vice versa. You yourself are committing the logical fallacy of begging the question as well, it really is both Ironic and comical. Highest Damage? I think you've gotta be a little more specific, theres plenty of abilities that out damage Aspects of Anakin. Might want to flesh this point out a little.
    Projecting at it's finest. You continue to evade the point that Anakin would still have the best abilities and damage which negates your premise that he would be broken with nerfed HP stats.

    He objectively has the best abilities even your Anakin squamate chosen one pointed out early that the devs made him as a counter to what was at that time a DS skew with many powerful abilities. I haven't committed any fallacy as I clearly stated the evidence. Which is the stats that he has the highest saber damage and the best abilities. His abilities are the best as I already mentioned because he has 4 concrete abilities which the devs distinguished him with.
    And yet you didn't mention nerfing any of his other abilities like Heroic Might or his retribution, instead you insisted the more important thing was nerfing his "HP and Regen" significantly. His pull range also encompasses his "abilities" like I said so it isn't so much comprehension on my end, but more or less nuance in you're post. If you're not precluding his other abilities from being nerfed, especially in a vague manner then it's on you to make it explicitly clear. You might wan't to do some introspection, because it's not my comprehension skills that are in question. Thanks.
    Actually it is your comprehension in question because I clearly stated that they are nerfing the wrong things specifying pull. I have no problem if his other abilities get's nerfed. He's still standing out with 4 powerful abilities. He's so unbalanced there's rarely matches without him. You cannot say that about others.
    Now you're the one drawing a false conclusion here, you spoke of my comprehension skills when I drew a reasonable inference from your original post, and yet you do it here as well but with an obviously warped bent. You can't have it both ways, johnny, so please, thoroughly read with context next time.

    In near the same breath, my exact quote was "I'll repeat again, 200 regen, on any melee hero is a broken concept, it's unbalanced and with just 700 HP it would render anakin bottom tier" Clearly I'm saying his actual HP is fine at 800, and you nerfing it by a 100 would be unbalanced. Again, I'm not "distracting" from anything and made it clear where stand from the very beginning.

    I'm afraid it's you committing most of the logical fallacies here if anything, red herring? Please, don't make me laugh. You keep on regurgitating the same warped arguments over and over again in an obvious bid to reframe my argument into something you have a chance of beating, It's clear as day.
    You just continue to try to flip it on me, when it's just you drawing the false conclusion. You wrote, "You want to talk about his other stats? Fine." This literally suggests his OP HP stats can be nerfed, otherwise you should have been more clear.

    I know you agree if you drew up your own values, I don't care about them. You can adjust them to your whim. The central point is his OP HP stats should be nerfed.

    I already did. Simply put, your stat changes would break anakin, and make him underpowered. I'm not interested in repeating why. It's now up to you if you're going to comprehend this, or continue in this form of inanity and dredge up those go-to talking points of yours.
    Yet you continue to not acknowledge that Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest saber damage. I already mentioned earlier that the numbers are mere tokens. As long as they nerf his HP stats on the whole I'm not keen on the exact values.

    My main point which you continue to distract from is his HP stats should be nerfed. Something you conceded to already earlier.
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  • Don't know why y'all arguing. They're never gonna nerf anakins hp to 700 & give him 200 hp with slow regen. 1. it's not balanced & 2. Would just ruin him for hero vs villians.
  • You did not support your claim.
    I did. You just can't follow the natural progression. This is where that "comprehension" was supposed to come into play.
    Projecting at it's finest. You continue to evade the point that Anakin would still have the best abilities and damage which negates your premise that he would be broken with nerfed HP stats.
    You say he has the "best" abilities but you can't really definitively say that, again, this is more of that "begging the question" you like to project away form yourself. This is a great opportunity for you to go ahead and provide some of that "data" to support your claim, since a rational explanation and logical progression obviously isn't up to par.
    He objectively has the best abilities even your Anakin squamate chosen one pointed out early that the devs made him as a counter to what was at that time a DS skew with many powerful abilities. I haven't committed any fallacy as I clearly stated the evidence. Which is the stats that he has the highest saber damage and the best abilities. His abilities are the best as I already mentioned because he has 4 concrete abilities which the devs distinguished him with.

    Yes he has a 4th active ability like boba, and they all synergize well, but to objectively call them all the "best" actually just shows your own "bias". This is inherently a subjective matter. Passionate strike is bad on it's own and needs to be chained with his other knockdowns to be made more useful. His pull requires him to be at ground level, Heroic might requires damage input to be made lethal, even he has drawbacks. Best /=/ More abilities, thats two different arguments, the devs "distinguishing" him means nothing in this context.
    Actually it is your comprehension in question because I clearly stated that they are nerfing the wrong things specifying pull. I have no problem if his other abilities get's nerfed. He's still standing out with 4 powerful abilities. He's so unbalanced there's rarely matches without him. You cannot say that about others.
    My comprehensions not in question. Be more specific next time in your posts then, don't deride me for making a sound inference from your argument, when you yourself engage in the same behavior and much more sloppily, at times totally ignoring the context of my statements.
    You just continue to try to flip it on me, when it's just you drawing the false conclusion. You wrote, "You want to talk about his other stats? Fine." This literally suggests his OP HP stats can be nerfed, otherwise you should have been more clear.
    Again, if theres a "comprehension" issue it's definitely on your end. I should've been more clear? I already spelled it out to you, through this thread, and in the same post you quoted I even provided the full context to make clear my stance on his HP. It can't get anymore "clear" than that. Again, it's also quite hypocritical of you to draw an inference from my argument, especially the wrong one, and then deride me for doing the same to yours. Especially when you were much more vague, and open ended in near all of yours.
    I know you agree if you drew up your own values, I don't care about them. You can adjust them to your whim. The central point is his OP HP stats should be nerfed.
    Those aren't my own Values, It's simply his default stats. 800 HP, and 250 regen. You Claim thats OP yet Grievous and Vader both have those default HP Values. Clearly they're not overpowered, so perhaps it's the actual other stats, or dare I say abilities that makes anakin OP? Will you ever be able to "comprehend" this? Or am I just not being "clear enough" again? Please, this is just laughable.
    Yet you continue to not acknowledge that Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest saber damage. I already mentioned earlier that the numbers are mere tokens. As long as they nerf his HP stats on the whole I'm not keen on the exact values.
    I'm afraid not John. Anakin has the highest base saber damage in the game, at 10 more than the next best hero. It's still a 2 hit kill on infantry so I consider it negligible. When Cards become involved Dooku Has the Highest Saber damage at 180. To call his abilities the "best" is again, begging the question if you don't provide evidence as to why, something you just seem to excel at. 750-800 HP and 250 Regen is pretty standard on a Saber user, so nerfing them is a non-starter, no matter how "keen" you really are. Sorry to burst your bubble.
    My main point which you continue to distract from is his HP stats should be nerfed. Something you conceded to already earlier.
    His HP Stats are 800 HP and 250 regen, there's nothing OP about it, and we're not nerfing that. It's a non-starter. I've conceded nothing to you, and will continue to do so.

    Your move.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
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  • I did. You just can't follow the natural progression. This is where that "comprehension" was supposed to come into play.

    You say he has the "best" abilities but you can't really definitively say that, again, this is more of that "begging the question" you like to project away form yourself. This is a great opportunity for you to go ahead and provide some of that "data" to support your claim, since a rational explanation and logical progression obviously isn't up to par.

    Yes he has a 4th active ability like boba, and they all synergize well, but to objectively call them all the "best" actually just shows your own "bias". This is inherently a subjective matter. Passionate strike is bad on it's own and needs to be chained with his other knockdowns to be made more useful. His pull requires him to be at ground level, Heroic might requires damage input to be made lethal, even he has drawbacks. Best /=/ More abilities, thats two different arguments, the devs "distinguishing" him means nothing in this context.

    I'm afraid not John. Anakin has the highest base saber damage in the game, at 10 more than the next best hero. It's still a 2 hit kill on infantry so I consider it negligible. When Cards become involved Dooku Has the Highest Saber damage at 180. To call his abilities the "best" is again, begging the question if you don't provide evidence as to why, something you just seem to excel at. 750-800 HP and 250 Regen is pretty standard on a Saber user, so nerfing them is a non-starter, no matter how "keen" you really are. Sorry to burst your bubble.

    His HP Stats are 800 HP and 250 regen, there's nothing OP about it, and we're not nerfing that. It's a non-starter. I've conceded nothing to you, and will continue to do so.

    Your move.

    I already provided the data that he has 4 powerful abilities more than anyone else. Anakin is the only hero that has 4 abilities listed in the ability quick view. Now you are committing another fallacy called strawmaning by trying to frame my position as best=more. It does not mean that, but something can be the best because of quantity on top of quality. Which is the case here, Anakin has 4 game changing abilities with powercreep.
    My comprehensions not in question. Be more specific next time in your posts then, don't deride me for making a sound inference from your argument, when you yourself engage in the same behavior and much more sloppily, at times totally ignoring the context of my statements.

    Again, if theres a "comprehension" issue it's definitely on your end. I should've been more clear? I already spelled it out to you, through this thread, and in the same post you quoted I even provided the full context to make clear my stance on his HP. It can't get anymore "clear" than that. Again, it's also quite hypocritical of you to draw an inference from my argument, especially the wrong one, and then deride me for doing the same to yours. Especially when you were much more vague, and open ended in near all of yours.
    It is in question because you are making false inferences from things that are not even remotely suggested. You should've been clearer in your initial point, you're not being direct.
    Those aren't my own Values, It's simply his default stats. 800 HP, and 250 regen. You Claim thats OP yet Grievous and Vader both have those default HP Values. Clearly they're not overpowered, so perhaps it's the actual other stats, or dare I say abilities that makes anakin OP? Will you ever be able to "comprehend" this? Or am I just not being "clear enough" again? Please, this is just laughable.
    This is exactly showing your lack of comprehension. I said you could come up with your own values. Also Anakin has 3 health star cards on top of that. Clearly OP when he also has the best abilities and highest saber damage.

    Your bias is clear when you fixate on his abilities being OP whereas deny that his HP stats are also inflated.


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  • I already provided the data.
    You've provided nothing. No substance and only your opinion, I'm simply afraid this data you speak of simply doesn't exist, nor does any for why Lukes regen is the biggest factor holding him back in GA currently. It seems all you have at your disposal is a rational argument to make your case, which you've yet to provide, and apparently isn't good enough to make a point.
    that he has 4 powerful abilities more than anyone else. Anakin is the only hero that has 4 abilities listed in the ability quick view.
    Ah, you're learning, sure they're listed in the quick view tab, but it still doesn't detract from the fact that Boba has 4 abilities as well. This is just semantics, nothing more.
    Now you are committing another fallacy called strawmaning by trying to frame my position as best=more. It does not mean that, but something can be the best because of quantity on top of quality. Which is the case here, Anakin has 4 game changing abilities with powercreep.
    You're great at pivoting, but not so much at arguing a point. I've made no such straw man and all you've done is just contradicted yourself with your own words.
    "His abilities are the best as I already mentioned because he has 4 concrete abilities"
    wether they're "concrete" or not is irrelevant. To call each individual one the "best" abilities, which is undeniably what is being inferred here by your statements, is again nothing more than you committing the logical fallacy of begging the question. Talk about projection.
    It is in question because you are making false inferences from things that are not even remotely suggested. You should've been clearer in your initial point, you're not being direct.
    A stretch if I've ever seen one, I was quite direct and even provided a quote so you could have proper context. You were Vague and obscure at best, there was no "false" inference on my part, and the conclusion I drew was sound given the context of your post, it's clear cut an dry I'm afraid.
    This is exactly showing your lack of comprehension. I said you could come up with your own values. Also Anakin has 3 health star cards on top of that. Clearly OP when he also has the best abilities and highest saber damage.
    Wrong again. Previously I mentioned those exact same Values and why they should stay where they're at. When you say you "don't care" about whatever values I "drew(draw) up" I was merely reiterating those where his base stats, nothing more.
    Also, Anakin has 3 health star cards on top of that. Clearly OP when he also has the best abilities and highest saber damage.
    No he doesn't. He only Has 2, this only reinforces the idea that you really don't know what you're talking about here. You're wearing. John. His Star cards weren't also at all mentioned in your initial premise, please, stay on topic. This was about his so called "OP Health stats" and so far you've made zero gains on your argument, it's simply crumbling.
    Your bias is clear when you fixate on his abilities being OP whereas deny that his HP stats are also inflated.
    800 HP and 250 regen is not inflated. Try again. John.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
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  • You've provided nothing. No substance and only your opinion, I'm simply afraid this data you speak of simply doesn't exist, nor does any for why Lukes regen is the biggest factor holding him back in GA currently. It seems all you have at your disposal is a rational argument to make your case, which you've yet to provide, and apparently isn't good enough to make a point.

    Ah, you're learning, sure they're listed in the quick view tab, but it still doesn't detract from the fact that Boba has 4 abilities as well. This is just semantics, nothing more.

    You're great at pivoting, but not so much at arguing a point. I've made no such straw man and all you've done is just contradicted yourself with your own words.

    wether they're "concrete" or not is irrelevant. To call each individual one the "best" abilities, which is undeniably what is being inferred here by your statements, is again nothing more than you committing the logical fallacy of begging the question. Talk about projection.

    A stretch if I've ever seen one, I was quite direct and even provided a quote so you could have proper context. You were Vague and obscure at best, there was no "false" inference on my part, and the conclusion I drew was sound given the context of your post, it's clear cut an dry I'm afraid.

    Wrong again. Previously I mentioned those exact same Values and why they should stay where they're at. When you say you "don't care" about whatever values I "drew(draw) up" I was merely reiterating those where his base stats, nothing more.

    No he doesn't. He only Has 2, this only reinforces the idea that you really don't know what you're talking about here. You're wearing. John. His Star cards weren't also at all mentioned in your initial premise, please, stay on topic. This was about his so called "OP Health stats" and so far you've made zero gains on your argument, it's simply crumbling.

    800 HP and 250 regen is not inflated. Try again. John.

    I already provided evidence but you are just continuing to use red herrings to distract from the core point.

    My point:
    1. Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed
    2. Luke is bad in GA for a combination of reasons
    Your counter-point:
    1. Anakin would be UP with nerfed HP stats
    2. Luke is bad in GA mostly because he has lower Regen
    My rebuttal:
    1. Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest saber damage
    2. Luke is bad in GA because of several reasons such as weak abilities, low damage, poor health stats, etc- it is fallacious to claim that Luke is bad in GA mostly because he has low regen as it's clearly not a black or white situation as shown above and you haven't provided any data that demonstrates that Luke is bad in GA mostly because his low regen.

    You haven't added anything to the above in all this time since. You are merely arguing in circles at this point repeating yourself.

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  • I already provided evidence but you are just continuing to use red herrings to distract from the core point.


    My rebuttal:
    1. Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest saber damage
    2. Luke is bad in GA because of several reasons such as weak abilities, low damage, poor health stats, etc- it is fallacious to claim that Luke is bad in GA mostly because he has low regen as it's clearly not a black or white situation as shown above and you haven't provided any data that demonstrates that Luke is bad in GA mostly because his low regen.

    You haven't added anything to the above in all this time since. You are merely arguing in circles at this point repeating yourself.
    I've used no Red herrings, rather it's you who has to resort to such tactics, you're arguments and rebuttals are flimsy at best. This is simply a topic you can't win, because the premise was wrong from the beginning.

    1. Wrong, you're again committing the logical Fallacy of begging the question. I already mentioned why 140 saber damage is irrelevant as well.

    2. You've provided zero "data" as well to back up any of your claims either. Referencing the abilities in the quick view menu is asinine and not "data". Nor is it fallacious to claim Luke is mostly held back by his poor regen, I've already demonstrated why with sound reasoning, your inability to follow the natural progression of my argument is simply on you.

    I've made more tangible points than you all throughout this thread. You simply making declarative statements without backing them up as to why isn't a credible argument making strategy. At this point, you're the one who's the broken record.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
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  • I already provided evidence but you are just continuing to use red herrings to distract from the core point.


    My rebuttal:
    1. Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest saber damage
    2. Luke is bad in GA because of several reasons such as weak abilities, low damage, poor health stats, etc- it is fallacious to claim that Luke is bad in GA mostly because he has low regen as it's clearly not a black or white situation as shown above and you haven't provided any data that demonstrates that Luke is bad in GA mostly because his low regen.

    You haven't added anything to the above in all this time since. You are merely arguing in circles at this point repeating yourself.
    I've used no Red herrings, rather it's you who has to resort to such tactics, you're arguments and rebuttals are flimsy at best. This is simply a topic you can't win, because the premise was wrong from the beginning.

    1. Wrong, you're again committing the logical Fallacy of begging the question. I already mentioned why 140 saber damage is irrelevant as well.

    2. You've provided zero "data" as well to back up any of your claims either. Referencing the abilities in the quick view menu is asinine and not "data". Nor is it fallacious to claim Luke is mostly held back by his poor regen, I've already demonstrated why with sound reasoning, your inability to follow the natural progression of my argument is simply on you.

    I've made more tangible points than you all throughout this thread. You simply making declarative statements without backing them up as to why isn't a credible argument making strategy. At this point, you're the one who's the broken record.

    You're committing a red herring again just now in distracting from the core point.

    1. You haven't acknowledged that Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest saber damage. Trying to even claim that Anakin doesn't have the best abilities and HP stats discredits your position as he has objectively the highest HP pool plus cards.

    2. Another fallacy called tu quoque by trying to keep hypocriticalltly deflecting. I already provided data- the combination of reasons. You haven't provided any data that proves Luke regen is definitively the main reason he is bad in GA. Also you fail to mention that Luke also has less regen delay and faster regen speed which makes up for his 200 regen. This negates your point.

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  • AbyssWatch3r
    4974 posts Member
    edited April 13
    You're committing a red herring again just now in distracting from the core point.
    You're Committing a red herring again. Stay on topic please, this thread was about his OP health stats, this is already an inherently discredited position, and I have detailed at length why.
    1. You haven't acknowledged that Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest saber damage. Trying to even claim that Anakin doesn't have the best abilities and HP stats discredits your position as he has objectively the highest HP pool plus cards.
    Anakin has the highest, base saber damage. But Not the Highest Max saber Damage. You're intentionally being oblique to support your crumbling argument. 140 damage over 130 is negligible at best, and I've already explained why. This is another red herring. I'll repeat it again for you his HP stats are 800 HP and 250 regen, they're not objectively the highest. You're factually incorrect. Your original post never mentioned star cards, so please, stay on topic. This is yet another example of you jumping to another point and in the process further discrediting your own position. It's that oh so common "red herring" you like to project onto others.

    Claiming Anakin has the "best" abilities without "data" is again you committing the logical fallacy of begging the question. You're pretty good at that, not so much making a rational argument.
    2. Another fallacy called tu quoque by trying to keep hypocriticalltly deflecting. I already provided data- the combination of reasons. You haven't provided any data that proves Luke regen is definitively the main reason he is bad in GA. Also you fail to mention that Luke also has less regen delay and faster regen speed which makes up for his 200 regen. This negates your point.
    No matter how much you desperately try to reframe my position it'll never hold up to scrutiny. I've committed zero logical fallacies in this thread, whereas you've made too many to number. The "data" you provided is an asinine assortment of declarative statements, and references to the quick view menu, ultimately they're meaningless.

    This "data" that you seek about Lukes regen is as real as the "data" you provided about anakins abilities being the "best". Simply put, it's purely a figment of your imagination. You're inability to follow a natural progression and sound reasoning is squarely on you.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
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  • You're Committing a red herring again. Stay on topic please, this thread was about his OP health stats, this is already an inherently discredited position, and I have detailed at length why.

    Keep trying to deflect. The point is laid out which you have yet to acknowledge as you just did another red herring by trying to distract from the main point again and again.
    Anakin has the highest, base saber damage. But Not the Highest Max saber Damage. You're intentionally being oblique to support your crumbling argument. 140 damage over 130 is negligible at best, and I've already explained why. This is another red herring. I'll repeat it again for you his HP stats are 800 HP and 250 regen, they're not objectively the highest. You're factually incorrect. Your original post never mentioned star cards, so please, stay on topic. This is yet another example of you jumping to another point and in the process further discrediting your own position. It's that oh so common "red herring" you like to project onto others.

    Claiming Anakin has the "best" abilities without "data" is again you committing the logical fallacy of begging the question. You're pretty good at that, not so much making a rational argument.

    Lol you clearly have no idea about logical fallacies as all you have done is tried to deflect them back at me hilarious. You can reiterate your point and add on.

    I already provided the data that he has the best abilities- he has 4 concrete abilities in the quick view which no other hero has. Plus his abilites have powercreep. As they are buffed verisions of moves already in the game.
    No matter how much you desperately try to reframe my position it'll never hold up to scrutiny. I've committed zero logical fallacies in this thread, whereas you've made too many to number. The "data" you provided is an asinine assortment of declarative statements, and references to the quick view menu, ultimately they're meaningless.

    This "data" that you seek about Lukes regen is as real as the "data" you provided about anakins abilities being the "best". Simply put, it's purely a figment of your imagination. You're inability to follow a natural progression and sound reasoning is squarely on you.

    Again commiting a red herring by distracting the from the main point that Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed.

    You cannot provide the evidence as your claim is irrelevant it is not falsifyable. I already pointed out that Luke has other better HP stats than his regen which balances it out. Another thing you have not acknowledged because it negated your point.



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  • AbyssWatch3r
    4974 posts Member
    edited April 13
    Keep trying to deflect. The point is laid out which you have yet to acknowledge as you just did another red herring by trying to distract from the main point again and again.
    Your main point was that his health stats were OP and needed to be nerfed. I've already Detailed why this is untrue, and every time without hesitation you instinctively distract from this with your own red herrings because it's a flimsy argument on the face of it. Please, stay on topic.
    Lol you clearly have no idea about logical fallacies as all you have done is tried to deflect them back at me hilarious. You can reiterate your point and add on.
    Theres nothing to deflect John when you fall into your own frames. Clearly it's you committing the logical fallacies here, begging the question and red herrings are your specialty.
    I already provided the data that he has the best abilities- he has 4 concrete abilities in the quick view which no other hero has. Plus his abilites have powercreep. As they are buffed verisions of moves already in the game.
    An assortment of declarative statements and references to the quick view menu is not "data" john, no matter how many times you repeat yourself.

    Again commiting a red herring by distracting the from the main point that Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed.
    No. I said his HP stats were 800 HP and 250 Regen, and have reiterated that they're quite standard issue and not in need of being changed, nor overpowered. Your main premise is inherently flawed.
    You cannot provide the evidence as your claim is irrelevant it is not falsifyable. I already pointed out that Luke has other better HP stats than his regen which balances it out. Another thing you have not acknowledged because it negated your point.
    Again, your inability follow the natural progression of my argument is squarely on you. The additional regen speed is irrelevant as again he still takes disproportionately more permanent damage than any other saber Hero in the game. That was my main point, and where reading comprehension was key to understanding. Hopefully now you can finally understand.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
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  • Your main point was that his health stats were OP needed to be nerfed. I've already Detailed why this is untrue, and every time without hesitation you instinctively distract from this with your own red herrings because it's a flimsy argument on the face of it. Please, stay on topic.

    Theres nothing to deflect John when you fall into your own frames. Clearly it's you committing the logical fallacies here, begging the question and red herrings are your specialty.

    An assortment of declarative statements and references to the quick view menu is not "data" john, no matter how many times you repeat yourself.

    No. I said his HP stats were 800 HP and 250 Regen, and have reiterated that they're quite standard issue and not in need of being changed, nor overpowered. Your main premise is inherently flawed.

    Again, your inability follow the natural progression of my argument is squarely on you. The additional regen speed is irrelevant as again he still takes disproportionately more permanent damage than any other saber Hero in the game. That was my main point, and where reading comprehension was key to understanding. Hopefully now you can finally understand.

    Just repeated conjecture and more tu quoque fallacies. Keep trying to deflect.

    The main point stands that Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed.

    You already conceeded earlier that his HP stats are OP.

    You commit the begging the question by not providing any data that that shows Anakin would be UP with HP stats when he would still have the best abilites and highest saber damage. I already provided the literal data that shows Anakin is the only one with 4 abilities in quick view and the only hero with an ability for the triangle button.
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  • So you guys are gonna keep arguing til the end of time huh?
  • AbyssWatch3r
    4974 posts Member
    edited April 13
    Just repeated conjecture and more tu quoque fallacies. Keep trying to deflect.
    You're guilty of your own allegations. As I said, you're a master of red herrings.
    The main point stands that Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed.
    That can be your prerogative, it certainly isn't mine and I've already explained why.
    You already conceeded earlier that his HP stats are OP.
    This simply a matter of your reading comprehension being at fault here. I've made no such concession. Try again.
    You commit the begging the question by not providing any data that that shows Anakin would be UP with HP stats when he would still have the best abilites and highest saber damage. I already provided the literal data that shows Anakin is the only one with 4 abilities in quick view and the only hero with an ability for the triangle button.

    I can turn the same argument on you, as you have not provided any data that shows Anakins HP stats are OP in the first place. His saber Damage is irrelevant as I've already said, and again claiming that he has the "best" abilities is just you begging the question. Your "data" isn't really data, and on the face of it worthless, it's nothing more than an assortment of your own declarative statements and an asinine reference to the abilities quick view menu.

    When can rehash this as much as you like, hopefully by the 100th time you'll finally get it.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
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  • You're guilty of your own allegations. As I said, you're a master of red herrings.

    That can be your prerogative, it certainly isn't mine and I've already explained why.

    This simply a matter of your reading comprehension being at fault here. I've made no such concession. Try again.

    I can turn the same argument on you, as you have not provided any data that shows Anakins HP stats are OP in the first place. His saber Damage is irrelevant as I've already said, and again claiming that he has the "best" abilities is just you begging the question. Your "data" isn't really data, and on the face of it worthless, it's nothing more than an assortment of your own declarative statements and an asinine reference to the abilities quick view menu.

    When can rehash this as much as you like, hopefully by the 100th time you'll finally get it.
    You already conceded his HP stats are OP you are just trying to backpedal now.

    I already provided data that shows Anakin's HP stats are OP. He has the highest HP pool with star cards and he has abilities with 90% damage reduction which make him harder to kill as is. The data that shows he has 4 abilities in the quick view is an objective fact, your attempts are minimizing it's relevance is simply your agenda. You haven't even acknowledged that he is the only hero with an ability in the triangle slot. He has two long duration AOE abilities with 90% damage reduction that no one else benefits from. That makes his abilities not only quantitatively the best but also qualitatively.

    You still haven't provided any data to show that Anakin would be UP with nerfed HP stats.
    hnytpwosbe30.png
  • If Anakin had 200 hp regen you wouldn't even notice. He can regenerate health by holding one freaking button. Besides, he can use his ridiculous 4th ability that can kill multiple troopers and multiple heroes in a matter of seconds. Moreover, he can kill heroes super easily by using his ridiculous combo (soon to be nerfed I hope).

    He needs a big fu*kin nerf.
  • AbyssWatch3r
    4974 posts Member
    edited April 13
    You already conceded his HP stats are OP you are just trying to backpedal now.
    Nope, I've conceded nothing. You don't have a quote, let alone a rational argument. Just palatable desperation and a last ditch effort to set up a new frame.
    I already provided data that shows Anakin's HP stats are OP. He has the highest HP pool with star cards and he has abilities with 90% damage reduction which make him harder to kill as is. The data that shows he has 4 abilities in the quick view is an objective fact, your attempts are minimizing it's relevance is simply your agenda. You haven't even acknowledged that he is the only hero with an ability in the triangle slot. He has two long duration AOE abilities with 90% damage reduction that no one else benefits from. That makes his abilities not only quantitatively the best but also qualitatively.
    Another red herring, you're good at this, john. His star cards weren't part of your original post, so please stop trying to change the argument, and stay on topic. He gets 90% damage reduction while being immobilized, while other Heroes get less while staying mobile, this is just a design choice and make's sense. To arbitrarily classify it as the "best" without evidence is just more of you begging the question. Unlike with your flawed rebuttal to my point about luke, this is entirely relevant.

    I'm also not in any way attempting to minimize the quick view menu's relevancy, it simply isn't. I'm correctly stating that it isn't supportive "data" nor relevant to your claim that he has the "best" abilities. You'll just have to make a rational argument as to why, though in doing so you'll just be further discrediting yourself, as you've made it clear that one isn't 'sufficient' enough to prove a point.

    Boba is the only hero with an ability in the left trigger spot, what button it's mapped too is irrelevant in this context. You can make the argument that he's one of the Heroes with the "most" abilities, but to call them the "best" is painting with a broad brush, and again, begging the question.
    You still haven't provided any data to show that Anakin would be UP with nerfed HP stats.
    I gave a rational argument as to why, and if you could comprehend it, you would. Data is a tertiary element to my argument and not at all necessary. You yourself have provided zero relevant "data" or why his abilities are the "best" and will continue to fail to find any, because it simply doesn't exist. Try again.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
    xnvLDB.gif
  • Wolfman91 wrote: »
    If Anakin had 200 hp regen you wouldn't even notice. He can regenerate health by holding one freaking button. Besides, he can use his ridiculous 4th ability that can kill multiple troopers and multiple heroes in a matter of seconds. Moreover, he can kill heroes super easily by using his ridiculous combo (soon to be nerfed I hope).

    He needs a big fu*kin nerf.

    If you could choose between nerfing his abilities or nerfing his HP stats, I'd focus solely on his abilities and CDs. 750-800 HP and 250 regen is pretty standard on any saber Hero and should remain. That's my stance here.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
    xnvLDB.gif
  • Nope, I've conceded nothing. You don't have a quote, let alone a rational argument. Just palatable desperation and a last ditch effort to set up a new frame.

    Another red herring, you're good at this, john. His star cards weren't part of your original post, so please stop trying to change the argument, and stay on topic. He gets 90% damage reduction while being immobilized, while other Heroes get less while staying mobile, this is just a design choice and make's sense. To arbitrarily classify it as the "best" without evidence is just more of you begging the question. Unlike with your flawed rebuttal to my point about luke, this is entirely relevant.

    I'm also not in any way attempting to minimize the quick view menu's relevancy, it simply isn't. I'm correctly stating that it isn't supportive "data" nor relevant to your claim that he has the "best" abilities. You'll just have to make a rational argument as to why, though in doing so you'll just be further discrediting yourself, as you've made it clear that one isn't 'sufficient' enough to prove a point.

    Boba is the only hero with an ability in the left trigger spot, what button it's mapped too is irrelevant in this context. You can make the argument that he's one of the Heroes with the "most" abilities, but to call them the "best" is painting with a broad brush, and again, begging the question.

    I gave a rational argument as to why, and if you could comprehend it, you would. Data is a tertiary element to my argument and not at all necessary. You yourself have provided zero relevant "data" or why his abilities are the "best" and will continue to fail to find any, because it simply doesn't exist. Try again.

    Your attempts at logic are laughable. One is completely allowed to add-on to their argument. The fact you are even suggesting otherwise is not only disingenuous but shows your lack of understand of logic.

    I already provided the quote where you concede that his stats are OP when you wrote, "You want to talk about his other stats? Fine." Which literally means you are okay with discussing nerfing his other HP stats. You should've framed it better if you wanted to be clear, for example providing data that would show Anakin would be UP with nerfed HP stats otherwise. Now you have backtracked and claim that his HP stats aren't OP.

    Boba Fett can fly at the expense of aiming like other blaster heroes, unlike Anakin who gets 4 concrete abilities complete with descriptions in quick view. He is the only one with an ability in the triangle slot which is unused for all other heroes currently. Bringing up Boba Fett only adds on to my argument that Anakin would still have the best abilities (as shown qualitatively and qualitatively earlier) as it clearly shows Anakin has 4 concrete abilities unlike others.

    You still haven't provided any data that would show his stats would be UP with nerfed HP stats.

    I already said the numbers are tokens which can be adjusted. It is irrelevant to the main point that Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed because he has the best HP stats combined with the best abilities and highest saber damage. Balancing him from being the absolute best hero currently to being a good hero would not make him broken lol. Even suggesting that only demonstrates your bias and invalids your position.

    hnytpwosbe30.png
  • AbyssWatch3r
    4974 posts Member
    edited April 13
    So you guys are gonna keep arguing til the end of time huh?

    I simply won't allow posts that contain fawning/fake intellectualism, blatantly absurd premises, or what I consider outright **** to go by uncontested. I suspect however he already knows none of his nerfs will ever come to fruition, because they're both inherently broken and terribly unbalanced for reasons previously described.

    Really this entire circus I suspect is nothing more than an attempt to save face at this point by means of attrition by talking around in circles, and on that point alone I'll give him credit.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
    xnvLDB.gif
  • Your attempts at logic are laughable. One is completely allowed to add-on to their argument. The fact you are even suggesting otherwise is not only disingenuous but shows your lack of understand of logic.
    Your inability to keep up with you're own train of thought, let alone mine just underscores just how out of left field you are. Never did I say, you weren't allowed to add on to your argument, it would actually be nice if you had a rational one to begin with. Rather it's you requesting, and even more so absurdly presenting "data" that is both irrelevant and non-existent to begin with. The real disingenuity here is you make believing you've got the slightest grasp on the argument you're making here.
    I already provided the quote where you concede that his stats are OP when you wrote, "You want to talk about his other stats? Fine." Which literally means you are okay with discussing nerfing his other HP stats.
    There you go drawing false conclusions again, on top of being a hypocrite.
    You should've framed it better if you wanted to be clear, for example providing data that would show Anakin would be UP with nerfed HP stats otherwise. Now you have backtracked and claim that his HP stats aren't OP.
    Theres nothing to backtrack from, since I never claimed his HP stats were ever OP in the first place. I even gave you proper context with the full quote. It was an asinine inference on your end, nothing more. As far as framing it better, you mentioned nerfing his abilities included the wrong things. The inference that I drew was more than reasonable from this, and your derision was both ironic and laughable.
    Boba Fett can fly at the expense of aiming like other blaster heroes, unlike Anakin who gets 4 concrete abilities complete with descriptions in quick view. He is the only one with an ability in the triangle slot which is unused for all other heroes currently. Bringing up Boba Fett only adds on to my argument that Anakin would still have the best abilities (as shown qualitatively and qualitatively earlier) as it clearly shows Anakin has 4 concrete abilities unlike others.
    You claimed he was the one hero with 4 abilities, and I simply stated boba does as well, this was to address your "quantitate" argument. Wether they're in the quick view menu, or mapped somewhere else is also irrelevant to the idea that they're the "best". This again is begging the question, and it seems your hopelessly trapped in this loop. Simply making a declarative statement that they're the best, and references to the quick view menu isn't "data". I'm afraid all you have is a rational argument to make your case, and as you've already said, it's apparently not up to par with your obtuse standards.
    You still haven't provided any data that would show his stats would be UP with nerfed HP stats.
    I provided a rational argument, both the "data" you seek, and provide are either irrelevant or non-existent. The fact that you keep coming to this point means you have no concrete rational argument of your own. Rather than attack mine, come up with your own, or concede that you indeed don't have one.
    I already said the numbers are tokens which can be adjusted. It is irrelevant to the main point that Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed because he has the best HP stats combined with the best abilities and highest saber damage. Balancing him from being the absolute best hero currently to being a good hero would not make him broken lol. Even suggesting that only demonstrates your bias and invalids your position.
    Vague Generalities that mean nothing, and are actually factually wrong. Anakin has 800 HP and 250 regen. Be specific and say whether your referring too base saber damage, or highest saber damage because it's actually dooku that holds that. To also falsely claim anakin has the "best" abilities is just you again in the endless loop of begging the question, and without sufficient evidence to back it up, it is your position that is invalid.

    Try again. John.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
    xnvLDB.gif
  • Your inability to keep up with you're own train of thought, let alone mine just underscores just how out of left field you are. Never did I say, you weren't allowed to add on to your argument, it would actually be nice if you had a rational one to begin with. Rather it's you requesting, and even more so absurdly presenting "data" that is both irrelevant and non-existent to begin with. The real disingenuity here is you make believing you've got the slightest grasp on the argument you're making here.

    There you go drawing false conclusions again, on top of being a hypocrite.

    Theres nothing to backtrack from, since I never claimed his HP stats were ever OP in the first place. I even gave you proper context with the full quote. It was an asinine inference on your end, nothing more. As far as framing it better, you mentioned nerfing his abilities included the wrong things. The inference that I drew was more than reasonable from this, and your derision was both ironic and laughable.

    You claimed he was the one hero with 4 abilities, and I simply stated boba does as well, this was to address your "quantitate" argument. Wether they're in the quick view menu, or mapped somewhere else is also irrelevant to the idea that they're the "best". This again is begging the question, and it seems your hopelessly trapped in this loop. Simply making a declarative statement that they're the best, and references to the quick view menu isn't "data". I'm afraid all you have is a rational argument to make your case, and as you've already said, it's apparently not up to par with your obtuse standards.


    I provided a rational argument, both the "data" you seek, and provide are either irrelevant or non-existent. The fact that you keep coming to this point means you have no concrete rational argument of your own. Rather than attack mine, come up with your own, or concede that you indeed don't have one.

    Vague Generalities that mean nothing, and are actually factually wrong. Anakin has 800 HP and 250 regen. Be specific and say whether your referring too base saber damage, or highest saber damage because it's actually dooku that holds that. To also falsely claim anakin has the "best" abilities is just you again in the endless loop of begging the question, and without sufficient evidence to back it up, it is your position that is invalid.

    Try again. John.

    Just more red herrings and conjecture in attempts to distract from the main point that Anakin should have nerfed HP stats. You conceded earlier but now backtracked and claim that nerfing his HP stats would make him UP or even more laughably 'broken'. You fixate on his base HP and regen, when I already said they are tokens which can be adjusted. My point is that they should nerf Anakin's HP stats in general, it doesn't matter to me what the exact values are as long as his HP stats are balanced.

    It's real simple. I have already provided my data (4 concrete abilities v 3 for everyone else) and arguments why Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed because he still would have the best abilities (both qualitatively and qualitatively) and the highest base saber damage.

    Provide an actual argument with data that shows nerfing Anakin's HP stats in general would break him, otherwise you are just continuing to commit more petitio principii fallacies.
    hnytpwosbe30.png
  • Wow, you three have a LOT of time to talk to each other today! I can't say I've been reading it all but I want to commend the devotion to....uh....commitment. 😁
  • I think when Anakin fails to block properly his lightsaber hand should fall off because it's canon.
  • The only thing that would fix anakin, for me anyway, is to remove either retribution or heroic might, simple as that.
    Anakin having TWO 360° AOE cc abilities that do not require aiming to use is not my idea of fun to use or be on the recceiving end of.
    Seeing him get shot in the face and cleaved by lightsabers by noobs on my team whilst he is charging Heroic Might to obliterate the entire vicinity with a repulse is just rediculous.

    They should swap heroic might with saber throw imo.

    Left ability: Pull Dominance
    Middle ability: Passionate Strike
    (without knockdown)
    Right ability: Saber throw

    Also 750-850 MAX hp
  • Just more red herrings and conjecture in attempts to distract from the main point that Anakin should have nerfed HP stats. You conceded earlier but now backtracked and claim that nerfing his HP stats would make him UP or even more laughably 'broken'. You fixate on his base HP and regen, when I already said they are tokens which can be adjusted. My point is that they should nerf Anakin's HP stats in general, it doesn't matter to me what the exact values are as long as his HP stats are balanced.
    Just more deflections, and your own red herrings on your end. Rather than contest a valid point you simply stick your fingers in your ears and flee to another front.
    I conceded nothing to you, john. At this point you're blatantly being disingenuous, if not, outright lying. You have no such quote, nor have I back peddled from such a quote. I was quite specific in my assessment, and you drawing a self admittedly wildly different conclusion is just evidence of poor reading comprehension on your end. If you can't follow syntax or read with context thats just on you.

    Your committing another red herring by changing the argument yet again, when you say his HP stats are just "tokens", whatever that means, it doesn't change the fact that you claimed he had "OP health stats" to begin with. I simply said his HP stats are 800 HP, 250 regen, and the default regen speed for every other saber Hero, I don't find them to be Overpowered in the slightest, and you've yet to provide relevant evidence as to why they are.
    It's real simple. I have already provided my data (4 concrete abilities v 3 for everyone else) and arguments why Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed because he still would have the best abilities (both qualitatively and qualitatively) and the highest base saber damage.
    Again, no matter what kind of adjective you throw behind the word "abilities" or wether Anakin has 4 listed abilities in the quick view menu, it's not real "data" nor in any way relevant to your core argument of him having the "best" abilities. Your still committing the logical fallacy of begging the question.Talk around this sticking point as much as you'd like, I'm not going to let you weasel your way out with projecting your poor argument away from yourself.

    Gameplay wise, anakin factually doesn't have the "most" abilities as boba fett has a jetpack as his which as a matter of fact kills your "quantitative" (not qualitative) argument. Qualitatively theres no "data" that you've provided that decisively proves he has the "best" abilities, you'll simply have to provide a rational argument as to why, which would only end up discrediting you even further, as apparently those aren't up to your standards as you've mentioned previously. I've already addressed his base saber damage and why it's by in large irrelevant, when cards are involved dooku has the highest max saber damage in the game.
    Provide an actual argument with data that shows nerfing Anakin's HP stats in general would break him, otherwise you are just continuing to commit more petitio principii fallacies.
    You've yet to provide any relevant "data" on why anakins HP stats are overpowered in the first place, and just declared that they were without providing any relevant evidence. Instead calling on me to justify my counters. It's called the onus probandi fallacy, and it's been the core of your argument from the beginning. It also explains why the case you make is flimsy and has no traction, nor will it ever be implemented. Let me reiterate that some asinine reference to the quick view menu and your own declarative statements saying that his HP stats are OP is not "evidence". If anything it's you who are the very definition of the petitio principii fallacy. It's no wonder either, it will indeed be quite the challenge convincing anybody that 800 HP and 250 regen inherently are even remotely "OP".

    Try again. John.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
    xnvLDB.gif
  • johnmangala
    491 posts Member
    edited April 14
    Just more deflections, and your own red herrings on your end. Rather than contest a valid point you simply stick your fingers in your ears and flee to another front.
    I conceded nothing to you, john. At this point you're blatantly being disingenuous, if not, outright lying. You have no such quote, nor have I back peddled from such a quote. I was quite specific in my assessment, and you drawing a self admittedly wildly different conclusion is just evidence of poor reading comprehension on your end. If you can't follow syntax or read with context thats just on you.

    Your committing another red herring by changing the argument yet again, when you say his HP stats are just "tokens", whatever that means, it doesn't change the fact that you claimed he had "OP health stats" to begin with. I simply said his HP stats are 800 HP, 250 regen, and the default regen speed for every other saber Hero, I don't find them to be Overpowered in the slightest, and you've yet to provide relevant evidence as to why they are.

    Again, no matter what kind of adjective you throw behind the word "abilities" or wether Anakin has 4 listed abilities in the quick view menu, it's not real "data" nor in any way relevant to your core argument of him having the "best" abilities. Your still committing the logical fallacy of begging the question.Talk around this sticking point as much as you'd like, I'm not going to let you weasel your way out with projecting your poor argument away from yourself.

    Gameplay wise, anakin factually doesn't have the "most" abilities as boba fett has a jetpack as his which as a matter of fact kills your "quantitative" (not qualitative) argument. Qualitatively theres no "data" that you've provided that decisively proves he has the "best" abilities, you'll simply have to provide a rational argument as to why, which would only end up discrediting you even further, as apparently those aren't up to your standards as you've mentioned previously. I've already addressed his base saber damage and why it's by in large irrelevant, when cards are involved dooku has the highest max saber damage in the game.

    You've yet to provide any relevant "data" on why anakins HP stats are overpowered in the first place, and just declared that they were without providing any relevant evidence. Instead calling on me to justify my counters. It's called the onus probandi fallacy, and it's been the core of your argument from the beginning. It also explains why the case you make is flimsy and has no traction, nor will it ever be implemented. Let me reiterate that some asinine reference to the quick view menu and your own declarative statements saying that his HP stats are OP is not "evidence". If anything it's you who are the very definition of the petitio principii fallacy. It's no wonder either, it will indeed be quite the challenge convincing anybody that 800 HP and 250 regen inherently are even remotely "OP".

    Try again. John.

    Continued projection.

    I provided the evidence. Now you will commit more petitio principii fallacies until you support your claim that nerfing Anakin's stats would break him.

    Provide data that shows nerfing Anakin's HP stats would break him.
    hnytpwosbe30.png
  • Continued projection.
    You're in my grasp, and have nothing but continued Tu Quoque(s) to defend yourself.
    I provided the evidence.
    Your "evidence", "data", or whatever you wan't to call it is irrelevant and doesn't prove your core point. I've already broke down why, refer to those posts.
    Now you will commit more petitio principii fallacies until you support your claim that nerfing Anakin's stats would break him.
    Another ignoratio elenchi, the burden of proof is on you, this is your thread and your main premise was that he had "OP health stats". Bringing up star cards, saber damage, providing nonsensical "data" concerning why he has the "best" abilities, and now demanding I provide "evidence" that your nerfs are misplaced are nothing more than distractions from your already crumbled main argument that he has overpowered health stats.

    And for the record I already supported this claim with a rational argument with a natural progression. Refer to that post if you have any additional comments.
    Provide data that shows nerfing Anakin's HP stats would break him.
    You and your argument are washed up, you've got nothing left but shifting the burden of proof, because your premise is inherently flawed and a circular argument from the get go. I'll reiterate again that 800 HP and 250 regen, is not remotely overpowered, contrary to your core claim, and you've yet to defend this point in a credible manner, whereas I have.

    Try again. John.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
    xnvLDB.gif
  • Day 2 of walls of paragraph
  • Continued projection.
    You're in my grasp, and have nothing but continued Tu Quoque(s) to defend yourself.
    I provided the evidence.
    Your "evidence", "data", or whatever you wan't to call it is irrelevant and doesn't prove your core point. I've already broke down why, refer to those posts.
    Now you will commit more petitio principii fallacies until you support your claim that nerfing Anakin's stats would break him.
    Another ignoratio elenchi, the burden of proof is on you, this is your thread and your main premise was that he had "OP health stats". Bringing up star cards, saber damage, providing nonsensical "data" concerning why he has the "best" abilities, and now demanding I provide "evidence" that your nerfs are misplaced are nothing more than distractions from your already crumbled main argument that he has overpowered health stats.

    And for the record I already supported this claim with a rational argument with a natural progression. Refer to that post if you have any additional comments.
    Provide data that shows nerfing Anakin's HP stats would break him.
    You and your argument are washed up, you've got nothing left but shifting the burden of proof, because your premise is inherently flawed and a circular argument from the get go. I'll reiterate again that 800 HP and 250 regen, is not remotely overpowered, contrary to your core claim, and you've yet to defend this point in a credible manner, whereas I have.

    Try again. John.

    Edit: repost.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
    xnvLDB.gif
  • Continued projection.
    You're in my grasp, and have nothing but continued Tu Quoque(s) to defend yourself.
    I provided the evidence.
    Your "evidence", "data", or whatever you wan't to call it is irrelevant and doesn't prove your core point. I've already broke down why, refer to those posts.
    Now you will commit more petitio principii fallacies until you support your claim that nerfing Anakin's stats would break him.
    Another ignoratio elenchi, the burden of proof is on you, this is your thread and your main premise was that he had "OP health stats". Bringing up star cards, saber damage, providing nonsensical "data" concerning why he has the "best" abilities, and now demanding I provide "evidence" that your nerfs are misplaced are nothing more than distractions from your already crumbled main argument that he has overpowered health stats.

    And for the record I already supported this claim with a rational argument with a natural progression. Refer to that post if you have any additional comments.
    Provide data that shows nerfing Anakin's HP stats would break him.
    You and your argument are washed up, you've got nothing left but shifting the burden of proof, because your premise is inherently flawed and a circular argument from the get go. I'll reiterate again that 800 HP and 250 regen, is not remotely overpowered, contrary to your core claim, and you've yet to defend this point in a credible manner, whereas I have.

    Try again. John.

    Edit: repost.

    Lol more conjecture.

    I haven't shifted any burden of proof, I met my burden of proof. You clearly don't even know how it works. The burden or proof is on anyone who is making a postive claim. I made the postive claim that Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed as he'd still remain with the best abilites and saber damage.

    Now you made the postive claim in counter that nerfing Anakin's HP stats would make him UP and even more lol- 'broken'.

    It is on you now to meet your burden of proof and provide supportive data that shows Anakin would be 'broken' with nerfed HP stats.

    Time to provide the data and evidence.
    hnytpwosbe30.png
  • Lol more conjecture.
    Oh the Irony.
    I haven't shifted any burden of proof, I met my burden of proof. You clearly don't even know how it works. The burden or proof is on anyone who is making a postive claim. I made the postive claim that Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed as he'd still remain with the best abilites and saber damage.
    Another red herring, you've yet to explain how he has "OP health stats" or even how his abilities are considered the "best" in the game, notwithstanding your faulty and irrelevant "data". You just defended this position with circular reasoning the entire thread, and now that your caught your attempting to alter your argument again, rather entirely shift the burden of proof to me without first providing factual evidence to your initial claim. I'm still waiting.
    Now you made the postive claim in counter that nerfing Anakin's HP stats would make him UP and even more lol- 'broken'.
    For the record, I already gave evidence as to why at the start of this discussion. I provided a rational argument with a logical progression. Your inability to comprehend, coupled with an attempt to discredit it with an appeal to ignorance, claiming there was no "data" to support it, is just another one of your red herrings. Nonetheless, refer to that post if you have additional comments.
    It is on you now to meet your burden of proof and provide supportive data that shows Anakin would be 'broken' with nerfed HP stats.

    Time to provide the data and evidence.
    Until you've adequately provided why Anakin has "overpowered HP stats" theres nothing further for me to defend. Despite all your appeals, the ball is ultimately still in your court to back up your main point, which you continually fail to do. You still haven't left square one. Please, do so, then this debate can actually progress, instead of being stuck at your initial premise.

    Try again. John.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
    xnvLDB.gif
  • Lol more conjecture.
    Oh the Irony.
    I haven't shifted any burden of proof, I met my burden of proof. You clearly don't even know how it works. The burden or proof is on anyone who is making a postive claim. I made the postive claim that Anakin's HP stats should be nerfed as he'd still remain with the best abilites and saber damage.
    Another red herring, you've yet to explain how he has "OP health stats" or even how his abilities are considered the "best" in the game, notwithstanding your faulty and irrelevant "data". You just defended this position with circular reasoning the entire thread, and now that your caught your attempting to alter your argument again, rather entirely shift the burden of proof to me without first providing factual evidence to your initial claim. I'm still waiting.
    Now you made the postive claim in counter that nerfing Anakin's HP stats would make him UP and even more lol- 'broken'.
    For the record, I already gave evidence as to why at the start of this discussion. I provided a rational argument with a logical progression. Your inability to comprehend, coupled with an attempt to discredit it with an appeal to ignorance, claiming there was no "data" to support it, is just another one of your red herrings. Nonetheless, refer to that post if you have additional comments.
    It is on you now to meet your burden of proof and provide supportive data that shows Anakin would be 'broken' with nerfed HP stats.

    Time to provide the data and evidence.
    Nice try, but we're not shifting the premise, and until you've adequately provided why Anakin has "overpowered HP stats" theres nothing further for me to defend. Despite all your appeals, the ball is ultimately still in your court to back up your main point, which you continually fail to do. You still haven't left square one. Please, do so and with real "data" and credible points, then this debate can actually progress, instead of being stuck at your initial premise.

    Try again. John.

    Edit: repost.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
    xnvLDB.gif
  • Just swap Luke’s health and health regen with anakin and give Luke 800 health and 250 regen
  • Oh the Irony.

    Another red herring, you've yet to explain how he has "OP health stats" or even how his abilities are considered the "best" in the game, notwithstanding your faulty and irrelevant "data". You just defended this position with circular reasoning the entire thread, and now that your caught your attempting to alter your argument again, rather entirely shift the burden of proof to me without first providing factual evidence to your initial claim. I'm still waiting.

    For the record, I already gave evidence as to why at the start of this discussion. I provided a rational argument with a logical progression. Your inability to comprehend, coupled with an attempt to discredit it with an appeal to ignorance, claiming there was no "data" to support it, is just another one of your red herrings. Nonetheless, refer to that post if you have additional comments.

    Nice try, but we're not shifting the premise, and until you've adequately provided why Anakin has "overpowered HP stats" theres nothing further for me to defend. Despite all your appeals, the ball is ultimately still in your court to back up your main point, which you continually fail to do. You still haven't left square one. Please, do so and with real "data" and credible points, then this debate can actually progress, instead of being stuck at your initial premise.

    Try again. John.

    You continue to just deflect from the point.

    It's simple. I met my burden of proof- I showed Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest saber damage if his HP stats were nerfed. The fact you have failed to provide any data and evidence to support your counter argument that nerfing Anakin's HP stats would make him 'broken' shows that you have none since you would've just come out with it by now.

    Provide the evidence and data.
    hnytpwosbe30.png
  • You continue to just deflect from the point.
    Oh the Irony.
    It's simple. I met my burden of proof- I showed Anakin would still have the best abilities and highest saber damage if his HP stats were nerfed.
    An irrelevant conclusion to your main point that he has "OP HP stats", I'm afraid your simply evading and distracting from the core argument from the beginning of this thread. I have been consistent in my replies, and you've reliably and continually shifted the playing field to suit your weak position. From still failing to confirm why he has the "best" abilities to your biased/irrelevant "data", we're still waiting on you to provide evidence as to why anakins health stats are overpowered. You have not met the burden of proof, but by a petitio principii Fallacy. Your premise has yet to have been answered by any point since, let alone in the original post. 800 HP and 250 regen. I'm still waiting.

    WLPgDQ.gif
    The fact you have failed to provide any data and evidence to support your counter argument that nerfing Anakin's HP stats would make him 'broken' shows that you have none since you would've just come out with it by now.

    Provide the evidence and data.

    The burden of evidence is not yet in my field until you finally settle and provide a reasonable explanation to your main premise as to why anakin has "OP HP stats" to begin with. Falsely claiming with flimsy evidence and "data" that he has the "best" abilities in the game, or even haphazardly linking his base saber damage to his base HP effectively doesn't address your main premise from the very the beginning of this thread. Theres no rebuttal or counter argument on my end to a non-point. Give credible evidence to your initial premise that doesn't involve the quick view menu, your own petitio principiis, or any other faulty "data", and I will respond accordingly. Perhaps a rational argument with a natural progression would serve you well here, if you hadn't already eliminated that option.

    When you finally realize that you don't in fact have ample evidence to support your claim that 800 HP and 250 regen constitutes "OP health stats", or at least have something else to throw against the wall, we can finally get out of this endless loop of me simply keeping you on topic and pressing you to answer your own premise.

    Try again. John.
    This is how you teach scrubs:
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