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EA/Dice you’re making a mistake getting rid of targeting system

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  • In any case, I’m ready for something new and looking forward to next week.

    Also looking forward to seeing all the gripes on the new ruleset. There will be none from me.

    No gripes from me either. Target system is rock bottom. Any changes will only make the mode better. There's no where to go but up from the target system.

    Man, I played more HvV this weekend than I have in months. Some folks ran a little every match, but largely it was a retreat to teammates or a play for time when outnumbered. There was not a single instance where a runner decided a match. Frankly, the whole idea of running isn’t even worth mentioning from my matches. I had much fun.

    I played a round on Friday night. I was Obi Wan, tailing a running Boba Fett. I was trying to cut off they're ability to turn around and flank back the opposite direction. Our Anakin was working around the other side of the map looking to cut Fett off. Pretty sure Chewie was AFK...

    Rey was our target. She was running too, trying to buy us time to catch Boba. At one point, Rey and Boba, both running away from attackers, actually crossed paths. But neither of them engaged. They literally ran past each other only meters apart. Neither of them acknowledged the other's existence. I just set my controller down, went upstairs, and made myself a sandwich.

    There’s no denying that Boba is a special case, the only flyer and all that. It’s going to be interesting to see him in a different ruleset.

    As far as crossing paths without engaging, yeah that would have irked me too, but only for a couple moments. Then I’d have put it behind me... easily forgotten.

    They will always allow children to play this game.

    Literal children. That's a thing that always is in the back of my mind when people come on here to talk about bad teams and bad teammates and people that just rush into battle or wander around. It very well could be a 5 year old....
  • Appl3corps wrote: »
    In any case, I’m ready for something new and looking forward to next week.

    Also looking forward to seeing all the gripes on the new ruleset. There will be none from me.

    No gripes from me either. Target system is rock bottom. Any changes will only make the mode better. There's no where to go but up from the target system.

    Man, I played more HvV this weekend than I have in months. Some folks ran a little every match, but largely it was a retreat to teammates or a play for time when outnumbered. There was not a single instance where a runner decided a match. Frankly, the whole idea of running isn’t even worth mentioning from my matches. I had much fun.

    I played a round on Friday night. I was Obi Wan, tailing a running Boba Fett. I was trying to cut off they're ability to turn around and flank back the opposite direction. Our Anakin was working around the other side of the map looking to cut Fett off. Pretty sure Chewie was AFK...

    Rey was our target. She was running too, trying to buy us time to catch Boba. At one point, Rey and Boba, both running away from attackers, actually crossed paths. But neither of them engaged. They literally ran past each other only meters apart. Neither of them acknowledged the other's existence. I just set my controller down, went upstairs, and made myself a sandwich.

    There’s no denying that Boba is a special case, the only flyer and all that. It’s going to be interesting to see him in a different ruleset.

    As far as crossing paths without engaging, yeah that would have irked me too, but only for a couple moments. Then I’d have put it behind me... easily forgotten.

    They will always allow children to play this game.

    Literal children. That's a thing that always is in the back of my mind when people come on here to talk about bad teams and bad teammates and people that just rush into battle or wander around. It very well could be a 5 year old....

    In fact it is. Even if they’re like 8-10 or even early teens. Every once in a while you even get a player who’s very young and who isn’t experienced in gaming much at all, let alone online multiplay.
  • In any case, I’m ready for something new and looking forward to next week.

    Also looking forward to seeing all the gripes on the new ruleset. There will be none from me.

    No gripes from me either. Target system is rock bottom. Any changes will only make the mode better. There's no where to go but up from the target system.

    Man, I played more HvV this weekend than I have in months. Some folks ran a little every match, but largely it was a retreat to teammates or a play for time when outnumbered. There was not a single instance where a runner decided a match. Frankly, the whole idea of running isn’t even worth mentioning from my matches. I had much fun.

    I played a round on Friday night. I was Obi Wan, tailing a running Boba Fett. I was trying to cut off they're ability to turn around and flank back the opposite direction. Our Anakin was working around the other side of the map looking to cut Fett off. Pretty sure Chewie was AFK...

    Rey was our target. She was running too, trying to buy us time to catch Boba. At one point, Rey and Boba, both running away from attackers, actually crossed paths. But neither of them engaged. They literally ran past each other only meters apart. Neither of them acknowledged the other's existence. I just set my controller down, went upstairs, and made myself a sandwich.

    There’s no denying that Boba is a special case, the only flyer and all that. It’s going to be interesting to see him in a different ruleset.

    As far as crossing paths without engaging, yeah that would have irked me too, but only for a couple moments. Then I’d have put it behind me... easily forgotten.

    They will always allow children to play this game.

    I put it behind me as soon as I bit into that delightful ham, turkey and swiss sandwich. All my irritations and anger went away. It was a hell of a good sandwich.

    Target system is trash. Thank God it's gone soon.
  • TjPunx
    1458 posts Member
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    @TjPunx Is that you in there?

    No the only walls I knew how to get into were Yavin (rip) and Hoth
  • Liz4rD wrote: »
    KresusFIN wrote: »
    OcDoc wrote: »
    Hero Blast only HELPS the runner issue and doesn’t even stop it and at the expense of entertainment value and the promotion of camping. I can’t support that.

    Runners now: Never contribute to teamfights. Still end up ensuring his team wins games because he was trash. Screws over an opposition that is obviously better than his team.

    Runners in TDM: You're literally only shooting yourself in the foot. Take part. Or don't. You no longer get to gift free points / victories to your team by running away and having the target whittled down.

    You have and incredible ability for not imagine things. Imagine Im Maul. I can run faster than anyone and make 15 metres jumps to make the gap even bigger between me and any chaser. I can even mantain ppl away with my force push. I run and run and in my third passing I saw a Yoda low on health, I rush and make the final blow. 1 free kill for me. I run away and hide in a corner, turn off my saber for its glowing not to reveal my position. Then again Yoda is near, and unaware of my pressence. He is low on health again because he just confronted Vader and got his *** seriously kicked. I run, jump, dash, two passings and hes dead. I run and return to my hiding or continue running around the map in the hope of finding another unaware player low on health. Will anyone chase Maul? In TM ppl chased Maul just because he was a target, but when Maul was not the target he usually did this tactic. Now in TDM he will use this tactic over and over again, and no one will want to chase him, because he is too fast and it is dangerous, he got all the advantage.

    How will TDM end the runner strategy? Running will be an effective strategy to get kills for a Luke or a Maul. Tell them that TDM wont allow this. And hear their laughter.

    Sorry but nope.

    Running is NOT going to help in TDM. Your little fairy tale of situations is literally the worst example of how running is going to benefit anyone in TDM. I challenge you to try running in TDM and tell me how it works for you.
  • This whole time it’s been nice seeing Jus try and be a voice of reasoning. Bro you run around with an officer and drop a turret the second you get hit. I watched a couple You Tube videos today while I was eating and why do I see you and your “crew” just stream sniping😂😂😂😂 complaining about exploits when y’all abuse many in GA 😂😂😂😂 please log off, there’s levels to this stuff 😉

    People "exploit" the cave's in Ewok Hunt. What the hell does that have to do with the target system? Please log off until you figure out what your point is...
  • Billkwando
    1644 posts Member
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.
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    ^Maximum the Hormone - Alien^
    (Sorta like an insane Japanese SOAD, but w/ 3 vocalists and slap bass)

    Gamertag: Billkwando YouTube: Billkwando
    Find me in HvV, pushing people off of stuff and watching them fall, like a cat.
  • Admiral_Xen
    2727 posts Member
    edited May 13
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.

    Lmao *strategy and intelligence

    * alt-tab to youtube, find all the glitch spots and have our Maul run/hide in them while we kill ourselves repeatedly to give him the target every time. Have our Boba respawn cheese his cooldowns to rocket barrage their target every 5 seconds. Switch to Lightside, Luke or Yoda takes over the role of Maul while Anakin gets a dedicated suicide bot to charge his Retribution to full 3 or 4 times every minute and grind the enemy team to dust.

    I can do, but simply don't wish to be forced to play that way by a bad ruleset just to beat down on horrible players doing the same. It's boring and exposes how poor a state the game's mechanics are in.

    TDM may be simple but at least it isn't actively promoting garbage respawn scumming and exploits as the optimal meta.
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    Founding member and commissar in chief of the Church of Janina. PSN: HanGerrelShot1st
  • Billkwando
    1644 posts Member
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.

    Lmao *strategy and intelligence

    * alt-tab to youtube, find all the glitch spots and have our Maul run/hide in them while we kill ourselves repeatedly to give him the target every time. Have our Boba respawn cheese his cooldowns to rocket barrage their target every 5 seconds. Switch to Lightside, Luke or Yoda takes over the role of Maul while Anakin gets a dedicated suicide bot to charge his Retribution to full 3 or 4 times every minute and grind the enemy team to dust.

    I can do, but simply don't wish to be forced to play that way by a bad ruleset just to beat down on horrible players doing the same. It's boring and exposes how poor a state the game's mechanics are in.

    TDM may be simple but at least it isn't actively promoting garbage respawn scumming and exploits as the optimal meta.

    I disagree.
    ZI7BNkU.gif
    ^Maximum the Hormone - Alien^
    (Sorta like an insane Japanese SOAD, but w/ 3 vocalists and slap bass)

    Gamertag: Billkwando YouTube: Billkwando
    Find me in HvV, pushing people off of stuff and watching them fall, like a cat.
  • The target system is terrible and it should have never even been in the game. Good riddance.
  • Darth_Vapor3
    3529 posts Member
    edited May 13
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.

    Lmao *strategy and intelligence

    * alt-tab to youtube, find all the glitch spots and have our Maul run/hide in them while we kill ourselves repeatedly to give him the target every time. Have our Boba respawn cheese his cooldowns to rocket barrage their target every 5 seconds. Switch to Lightside, Luke or Yoda takes over the role of Maul while Anakin gets a dedicated suicide bot to charge his Retribution to full 3 or 4 times every minute and grind the enemy team to dust.

    I can do, but simply don't wish to be forced to play that way by a bad ruleset just to beat down on horrible players doing the same. It's boring and exposes how poor a state the game's mechanics are in.


    TDM may be simple but at least it isn't actively promoting garbage respawn scumming and exploits as the optimal meta.

    I acknowledge this. This is the counter argument. The valid one. You can deal with runners and win, but what it takes to do so becomes a cat and mouse game. While all of this is tactically sound, the match inevitably turns into something many find undesirable. Well done Xen. I’ve been waiting for someone to get this close.

    You’re last part is opinion but hey, we’ve all got those. Some folks like the cat and mouse challenge. Particularly because hey seldom have to worry about runners. Others can’t buy a match without them.

    There should be more than one hero mode but we ain’t getting that.

    It’s time for a change.
  • TjPunx
    1458 posts Member
    It seems as though as everyone that wants a change to the targeting system, isn’t good at HvV, and wants something easier for themselves
  • Liz4rD
    973 posts Member
    KresusFIN wrote: »
    Liz4rD wrote: »
    KresusFIN wrote: »
    OcDoc wrote: »
    Hero Blast only HELPS the runner issue and doesn’t even stop it and at the expense of entertainment value and the promotion of camping. I can’t support that.

    Runners now: Never contribute to teamfights. Still end up ensuring his team wins games because he was trash. Screws over an opposition that is obviously better than his team.

    Runners in TDM: You're literally only shooting yourself in the foot. Take part. Or don't. You no longer get to gift free points / victories to your team by running away and having the target whittled down.

    You have and incredible ability for not imagine things. Imagine Im Maul. I can run faster than anyone and make 15 metres jumps to make the gap even bigger between me and any chaser. I can even mantain ppl away with my force push. I run and run and in my third passing I saw a Yoda low on health, I rush and make the final blow. 1 free kill for me. I run away and hide in a corner, turn off my saber for its glowing not to reveal my position. Then again Yoda is near, and unaware of my pressence. He is low on health again because he just confronted Vader and got his *** seriously kicked. I run, jump, dash, two passings and hes dead. I run and return to my hiding or continue running around the map in the hope of finding another unaware player low on health. Will anyone chase Maul? In TM ppl chased Maul just because he was a target, but when Maul was not the target he usually did this tactic. Now in TDM he will use this tactic over and over again, and no one will want to chase him, because he is too fast and it is dangerous, he got all the advantage.

    How will TDM end the runner strategy? Running will be an effective strategy to get kills for a Luke or a Maul. Tell them that TDM wont allow this. And hear their laughter.

    It will allow it just fine. That Maul just will not get to decide the outcome of a match all by himself.

    Run all you want. Nobody will chase you, and instead the folks on the Maul's team will only feed the opposition tickets, being down a man for teamfights all the time.

    The scenario is literally like I described it: "You no longer get to gift free points / victories to your team by running away, and your 3 other teammates slowly whittle down the opposing target."

    When everyone becomes a "target" (Which is really what TDM does), nobody will bother chasing a runner, because it's that much easier to fight and kill the people that actually play the game, rather than play tag with some weirdo not having any business in the mode to begin with.

    You are not getting the point at all. Maul can run and KILL with ease. No one will stop him and that will make him maybe deciding the outcome of a match. He is a HIT AND RUN character, you see?

    Everyone is not a target. Everyone counts if he or she is killed. Its NOT THE SAME. because characters are not designed to be balanced. So maybe that one who are the fastest got an advantage. And those in disadvantage wont fight them. So the 'TARGET' sign over Maul's head is smaller than other players'.
  • Liz4rD
    973 posts Member
    Liz4rD wrote: »
    KresusFIN wrote: »
    OcDoc wrote: »
    Hero Blast only HELPS the runner issue and doesn’t even stop it and at the expense of entertainment value and the promotion of camping. I can’t support that.

    Runners now: Never contribute to teamfights. Still end up ensuring his team wins games because he was trash. Screws over an opposition that is obviously better than his team.

    Runners in TDM: You're literally only shooting yourself in the foot. Take part. Or don't. You no longer get to gift free points / victories to your team by running away and having the target whittled down.

    You have and incredible ability for not imagine things. Imagine Im Maul. I can run faster than anyone and make 15 metres jumps to make the gap even bigger between me and any chaser. I can even mantain ppl away with my force push. I run and run and in my third passing I saw a Yoda low on health, I rush and make the final blow. 1 free kill for me. I run away and hide in a corner, turn off my saber for its glowing not to reveal my position. Then again Yoda is near, and unaware of my pressence. He is low on health again because he just confronted Vader and got his *** seriously kicked. I run, jump, dash, two passings and hes dead. I run and return to my hiding or continue running around the map in the hope of finding another unaware player low on health. Will anyone chase Maul? In TM ppl chased Maul just because he was a target, but when Maul was not the target he usually did this tactic. Now in TDM he will use this tactic over and over again, and no one will want to chase him, because he is too fast and it is dangerous, he got all the advantage.

    How will TDM end the runner strategy? Running will be an effective strategy to get kills for a Luke or a Maul. Tell them that TDM wont allow this. And hear their laughter.

    Sorry but nope.

    Running is NOT going to help in TDM. Your little fairy tale of situations is literally the worst example of how running is going to benefit anyone in TDM. I challenge you to try running in TDM and tell me how it works for you.

    IT helps killing in TM. Now that you wont be chased (you dont want to chase Maul or Luke, dont you?) , what in the Universe will stop you from running away as Maul and attack again from behind when everyone distracted, run away, rinse and repeat?
  • Darth_Vapor3
    3529 posts Member
    edited May 13
    Alex64 wrote: »
    Let me put this straight, its a SHOOTER, there should be WINNERS and LOSERS, and the winner should be decided by how much you kill your opponent and not by how much you run to avoid danger(SO TACTIC), the objective is to kill players ok?
    If you really like to run while playing the objective go and play racing games please.

    The objective is to kill the target and defend the shield. This can be accomplished with any tools at your disposal. Wall glitching is cheating. All other considerations are subjective. This is the ruleset.

    Doesn’t matter, it changes next week.
  • Liz4rD wrote: »
    Liz4rD wrote: »
    KresusFIN wrote: »
    OcDoc wrote: »
    Hero Blast only HELPS the runner issue and doesn’t even stop it and at the expense of entertainment value and the promotion of camping. I can’t support that.

    Runners now: Never contribute to teamfights. Still end up ensuring his team wins games because he was trash. Screws over an opposition that is obviously better than his team.

    Runners in TDM: You're literally only shooting yourself in the foot. Take part. Or don't. You no longer get to gift free points / victories to your team by running away and having the target whittled down.

    You have and incredible ability for not imagine things. Imagine Im Maul. I can run faster than anyone and make 15 metres jumps to make the gap even bigger between me and any chaser. I can even mantain ppl away with my force push. I run and run and in my third passing I saw a Yoda low on health, I rush and make the final blow. 1 free kill for me. I run away and hide in a corner, turn off my saber for its glowing not to reveal my position. Then again Yoda is near, and unaware of my pressence. He is low on health again because he just confronted Vader and got his *** seriously kicked. I run, jump, dash, two passings and hes dead. I run and return to my hiding or continue running around the map in the hope of finding another unaware player low on health. Will anyone chase Maul? In TM ppl chased Maul just because he was a target, but when Maul was not the target he usually did this tactic. Now in TDM he will use this tactic over and over again, and no one will want to chase him, because he is too fast and it is dangerous, he got all the advantage.

    How will TDM end the runner strategy? Running will be an effective strategy to get kills for a Luke or a Maul. Tell them that TDM wont allow this. And hear their laughter.

    Sorry but nope.

    Running is NOT going to help in TDM. Your little fairy tale of situations is literally the worst example of how running is going to benefit anyone in TDM. I challenge you to try running in TDM and tell me how it works for you.

    IT helps killing in TM. Now that you wont be chased (you dont want to chase Maul or Luke, dont you?) , what in the Universe will stop you from running away as Maul and attack again from behind when everyone distracted, run away, rinse and repeat?

    Easy... Losing. You wont win with that terrible strategy. You really think the runners are going to continue when they consistently lose because of their running?
  • TjPunx wrote: »
    It seems as though as everyone that wants a change to the targeting system, isn’t good at HvV, and wants something easier for themselves


    Then why do you want the target system to stay? Wouldn't that description mean you want TDM?
  • Liz4rD
    973 posts Member
    Alex64 wrote: »
    Let me put this straight, its a SHOOTER, there should be WINNERS and LOSERS, and the winner should be decided by how much you kill your opponent and not by how much you run to avoid danger(SO TACTIC), the objective is to kill players ok?
    If you really like to run while playing the objective go and play racing games please.

    Let me put this straight, it is a shooter with sabers and...erm...uh...

    Besides that, reading you is like being on acid.

    So, in a shooter you dont get behind cover. Or run to avoid a grenade. Or go to a top to snipe from there behind a rock. You stand there just in your respawn place, with your gun, no moving at all, hoping to be faster just at aiming.

    You must be the dumbest soldier in all the battlefields on all the shooters online or offline.

    Or maybe you never understood how this shooter stuff worked.



  • Alex64
    6715 posts Member
    Liz4rD wrote: »
    Alex64 wrote: »
    Let me put this straight, its a SHOOTER, there should be WINNERS and LOSERS, and the winner should be decided by how much you kill your opponent and not by how much you run to avoid danger(SO TACTIC), the objective is to kill players ok?
    If you really like to run while playing the objective go and play racing games please.

    Let me put this straight, it is a shooter with sabers and...erm...uh...

    Besides that, reading you is like being on acid.

    So, in a shooter you dont get behind cover. Or run to avoid a grenade. Or go to a top to snipe from there behind a rock. You stand there just in your respawn place, with your gun, no moving at all, hoping to be faster just at aiming.

    You must be the dumbest soldier in all the battlefields on all the shooters online or offline.

    Or maybe you never understood how this shooter stuff worked.



    There are many shooters that you can take as reference like Paladins or Overwatch(and they use heroes by the way) not only battlefield, oh but you say you know more about shooters, what a disgrace, i know more than you.
    E sono una imbranata
  • OcDoc
    1330 posts Member
    Alex64 wrote: »
    Let me put this straight, its a SHOOTER, there should be WINNERS and LOSERS, and the winner should be decided by how much you kill your opponent and not by how much you run to avoid danger(SO TACTIC), the objective is to kill players ok?
    If you really like to run while playing the objective go and play racing games please.

    I would have stayed away from making this comment. Half the mode is melee. This isn’t an argument about trooper TDM.

  • Alex64
    6715 posts Member
    OcDoc wrote: »
    Alex64 wrote: »
    Let me put this straight, its a SHOOTER, there should be WINNERS and LOSERS, and the winner should be decided by how much you kill your opponent and not by how much you run to avoid danger(SO TACTIC), the objective is to kill players ok?
    If you really like to run while playing the objective go and play racing games please.

    I would have stayed away from making this comment. Half the mode is melee. This isn’t an argument about trooper TDM.

    I don't understand your comment, but i guess you are talking about saber and blasters, well let me tell you that even with melee combat included this still being a shooter, i hope this answer your doubts.
    E sono una imbranata
  • quenaelin wrote: »
    That is what I like about Target System you have more tactical choices like in reality. You can camp or flee to win, more powerful opponent doesn't always win, call it cowardness or cleverness if you like. Though I don't like map glitch hiders, target timer would solve that problem.
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    I forgot to mention too (and I have video evidence to back it up) yesterday I played 3 HvV matches and in two of them there was a quitter in the other team. Both games lasted more than ten minutes without a replacement joining to fill their 4th. This was at 6PM on US east coast on Virginia servers. If there are indeed thousands upon thousands trying to play why then during a prime time hour on an extremely populated server was there not a single person found to fill the spot?

    The problem is that Dice matchmaking for this game is really bad. They have attempted to fix it once. It only improved slightly, so that people could join the same team if they were partied up. However, they haven't done anything else with it since then and it has tons of problems.


    People in here are FOOLISH if they thing changing HvV target to Hero Blast will change anything with the game mode. Hero Blast will be a huge pile of garbage still because the main two issues aren't being addressed with Target system. Those two issues are:
    1. Spawning and spawn points still spawn killed team members at opposite corners of the map. Making it hard to cross the map and rejoin the team without encountering the enemy team.
    2. Matchmaking in this game still sucks because it stacks the team typically with a lot of new people on one side and the experienced players on the other side. Give everyone a rank for each game mode based on how much they play or what rank they get overall in the game. This will be a "moving average rank" so that the last 10-20 games they played determine your overall rank. The rank is based on your overall scoreboard rank for each game. It should be a moving average of the scoreboard ranks, so that it takes into consideration how much you were doing the objective and killing enemies. All it needs to be moving average so that it adjusts with how you are playing. Scoreboard rank is a really quick and easy way to determine that without having to add more coding for determining people's rank some other way. Then in modes like HvV the game can balance the game as best as possible by ensuring that the average team rank is pretty close to each other. Or come up with something similar to this.

    The issue is that everyone thinks that the target mode itself is the problem. That is far from actuality. The real problem was when it would select the new target and the above two issues. If dice would have adjusted when it selected the target, so that 3/4 people had to be alive or wait until they were alive to do so. Then you wouldn't get a lot of these easy kills where it selected the new character

    Also any experienced team knows that while runners can be irritating, teamwork will stop a runner all the time. The game mode is quite fun and would work much better if they would have just fixed these issues.

    People keep going on and on about how every enconter will matter in Hero Blast, which is a highly laughable statement. The only encounters that will really matter are between the experienced and the new players. As the new players will die much more often and the game will boil down to whichever side has more of the new players. People will continue to leave the game because of this and I suspect that they will start leaving Hero Blast at a much higher rate than they are now in HvV because of this major imbalance issue. The final thing that people fail to realize is that the target system is there, so that new players are able to die more often than the rest of the team without completely ruining the game mode for everyone else. If the new people die more often than they are less likely to be the target and the more experienced players will become the target.
    People like you always defend the target system but it boils down to the same thing with different wordage. You are advocating for participation trophies. It stands within perfect reason that if team A is good experienced players and team B has new low skill gamers then of course team A will win and they should. If team B are bad players and they can win it means one of two things, either team B isn’t actually bad players, or the game design is flawed that gives wins to players that it shouldn’t.

    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    You are wrong. Truth is, you may not have ever been more wrong in you life.

    I’ll preface this by saying that those who use wall glitches to hide should all burn in... Well you get the idea.

    If your “perfect reason” description were actually true, the world would be a completely different place. This is basic combat tactics 101. When confronted with a superior force, be it numbers, or for our purposes skill, the lesser force must employ alternative tactics to win. The superior force will not, nor should not always win. Speed and maneuverability, and the breaking of the accepted(or in our case, desired) rules of engagement.

    It’s been said that a runner allows the remaining three on his team to slowly whittle down a superior team and get the point. This is true. It’s incumbent on the superior(more powerful) team to adapt to this tactic or be defeated. Calling this cowardly is a lazy excuse for getting defeated by choices instead of thumbs on controllers.

    Here are some real world historical examples.

    - Without the application of cowardly tactics, the United States would never have beaten the British in the Revolutionary War. Had they not learned to not just line up on the battlefield, and instead employ hit and run tactics when necessary, we would have lost. We almost learned too late. The British called them cowards for fighting this way. Washington crossed the Potomac River in the dead of winter to take the enemy by surprise. He was breaking the standard rules of engagement and using the terrain to his advantage. The British branded him cowardly... among other things.

    -At the Thrilla in Manila, Muhammed Ali ran from George Foreman for over three quarters of the match. Straight up ran... in boxing terms. He used the ropes(terrain) to his advantage with speed and maneuvering while conserving stamina. George, a beast of a man in his prime, should have won but was tired-out and psychology frustrated by this tactic. This was Ali in his thirties, after being out of boxing for several years. He was the inferior force of the two. It was termed rope-a-dope. No one called him a coward though, but he was credited with superior tactics. The Sweet Science.

    -Long ago 300 Spartans stood against Xerxes and a Persian army that they claim was a million strong. They used the mountain pass named Thermopylae to render the Persian numbers meaningless. They used terrain in such a fashion that some would call a it map exploit. (This is not the same as wall glitches. There are no terrain glitches in the real world) But it is the same as many things players in this game do that inconveniences opponents of superior skill. Unlike the British, the Persians adapted. They used another mountain pass to get behind the Spartans.

    -The Mujahideen Afghans vs the Russians in the 80’s.
    -The Viet-Cong vs the US.
    -General Patton vs Rommel in WWII.

    I could go on endlessly but you get the idea. These lesser forces were able to accomplish much more than they should have been able to because of tactics which were designed to thwart a superior force.

    They were all called cowards by the defeated.

    A superior force should win, but victory is, always has been, and always will be more than just who has the most power(skill).

    Now, I understand that a different ruleset would change the way matches would play. I also understand that some folks would appreciate a more basic playing field where the fella who’d win in a 1v1 through simple twitch reflexes would also translate into a 4v4. TDM will go along way towards that. Just don’t think for one second that the target system is intrinsically flawed because a lesser force can upset a greater one. That mentality has been the downfall of many more powerful(skilled) forces since the beginning of combat.

    The target system is almost gone. Whatever we get, don’t be surprised if some meta tactic arises for a lesser group to defeat a greater one. And this time around, adjust your own strategy before trying to change the rules again.

    @Darth_Vapor3 Well said. This is fantastic. It'll fall on deaf ears, however. I kinda feel this whole issue stems from individuals who just can't stand being bested, so they wish to take away the mode and restart it with another. Who really wants the participation trophies here? Otherwise, why would they care so much if the targeting system was left available in the game. Just don't play it.
    I'm very much looking forward to playing tdm/hb. Sounds like loads of fun! At the same time, I really enjoy playing the target system with my mates, and would like to be able to continue doing so.
  • OcDoc
    1330 posts Member
    Alex64 wrote: »
    OcDoc wrote: »
    Alex64 wrote: »
    Let me put this straight, its a SHOOTER, there should be WINNERS and LOSERS, and the winner should be decided by how much you kill your opponent and not by how much you run to avoid danger(SO TACTIC), the objective is to kill players ok?
    If you really like to run while playing the objective go and play racing games please.

    I would have stayed away from making this comment. Half the mode is melee. This isn’t an argument about trooper TDM.

    I don't understand your comment, but i guess you are talking about saber and blasters, well let me tell you that even with melee combat included this still being a shooter, i hope this answer your doubts.

    I disagree. I think you are partially right and I don’t think you are out in left field with your comment but I don’t feel you are correct.
  • Alex64
    6715 posts Member
    OcDoc wrote: »
    Alex64 wrote: »
    OcDoc wrote: »
    Alex64 wrote: »
    Let me put this straight, its a SHOOTER, there should be WINNERS and LOSERS, and the winner should be decided by how much you kill your opponent and not by how much you run to avoid danger(SO TACTIC), the objective is to kill players ok?
    If you really like to run while playing the objective go and play racing games please.

    I would have stayed away from making this comment. Half the mode is melee. This isn’t an argument about trooper TDM.

    I don't understand your comment, but i guess you are talking about saber and blasters, well let me tell you that even with melee combat included this still being a shooter, i hope this answer your doubts.

    I disagree. I think you are partially right and I don’t think you are out in left field with your comment but I don’t feel you are correct.

    And what do you think people should call them? Half melee action games?
    E sono una imbranata
  • Liz4rD
    973 posts Member
    Alex64 wrote: »
    Liz4rD wrote: »
    Alex64 wrote: »
    Let me put this straight, its a SHOOTER, there should be WINNERS and LOSERS, and the winner should be decided by how much you kill your opponent and not by how much you run to avoid danger(SO TACTIC), the objective is to kill players ok?
    If you really like to run while playing the objective go and play racing games please.

    Let me put this straight, it is a shooter with sabers and...erm...uh...

    Besides that, reading you is like being on acid.

    So, in a shooter you dont get behind cover. Or run to avoid a grenade. Or go to a top to snipe from there behind a rock. You stand there just in your respawn place, with your gun, no moving at all, hoping to be faster just at aiming.

    You must be the dumbest soldier in all the battlefields on all the shooters online or offline.

    Or maybe you never understood how this shooter stuff worked.



    There are many shooters that you can take as reference like Paladins or Overwatch(and they use heroes by the way) not only battlefield, oh but you say you know more about shooters, what a disgrace, i know more than you.

    None of this has to do with your comment. You said in a shooter you have not to avoid danger, instead is all about killing. Well, Overwatch and Paladins say no to that when in the last they got a somewhat cargo mode where the killings dont matter, and reaching the final point with the cargo is what matters. Ive played both.

    And by the way, Battlefront is a shooter that have a mode in which the most characters dont shoot anything, like HvsV. Its like saying that For Honour is a shooter lol.

    "oh but you say you know more about shooters". NO, Ive never said such a thing. Stop smoking BAD QUALITY WEED and inventing things.
  • Alex64
    6715 posts Member
    Liz4rD wrote: »
    Alex64 wrote: »
    Liz4rD wrote: »
    Alex64 wrote: »
    Let me put this straight, its a SHOOTER, there should be WINNERS and LOSERS, and the winner should be decided by how much you kill your opponent and not by how much you run to avoid danger(SO TACTIC), the objective is to kill players ok?
    If you really like to run while playing the objective go and play racing games please.

    Let me put this straight, it is a shooter with sabers and...erm...uh...

    Besides that, reading you is like being on acid.

    So, in a shooter you dont get behind cover. Or run to avoid a grenade. Or go to a top to snipe from there behind a rock. You stand there just in your respawn place, with your gun, no moving at all, hoping to be faster just at aiming.

    You must be the dumbest soldier in all the battlefields on all the shooters online or offline.

    Or maybe you never understood how this shooter stuff worked.



    There are many shooters that you can take as reference like Paladins or Overwatch(and they use heroes by the way) not only battlefield, oh but you say you know more about shooters, what a disgrace, i know more than you.

    None of this has to do with your comment. You said in a shooter you have not to avoid danger, instead is all about killing. Well, Overwatch and Paladins say no to that when in the last they got a somewhat cargo mode where the killings dont matter, and reaching the final point with the cargo is what matters. Ive played both.

    And by the way, Battlefront is a shooter that have a mode in which the most characters dont shoot anything, like HvsV. Its like saying that For Honour is a shooter lol.

    "oh but you say you know more about shooters". NO, Ive never said such a thing. Stop smoking BAD QUALITY WEED and inventing things.

    Sorry i just can't understand what are you trying to debate, it seems that you just don't know what to say and your last resource is to be salty.
    E sono una imbranata
  • Billkwando
    1644 posts Member
    edited May 14
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.

    Lmao *strategy and intelligence

    * alt-tab to youtube, find all the glitch spots and have our Maul run/hide in them while we kill ourselves repeatedly to give him the target every time. Have our Boba respawn cheese his cooldowns to rocket barrage their target every 5 seconds. Switch to Lightside, Luke or Yoda takes over the role of Maul while Anakin gets a dedicated suicide bot to charge his Retribution to full 3 or 4 times every minute and grind the enemy team to dust.

    I can do, but simply don't wish to be forced to play that way by a bad ruleset just to beat down on horrible players doing the same. It's boring and exposes how poor a state the game's mechanics are in.


    TDM may be simple but at least it isn't actively promoting garbage respawn scumming and exploits as the optimal meta.

    I acknowledge this. This is the counter argument. The valid one. You can deal with runners and win, but what it takes to do so becomes a cat and mouse game. While all of this is tactically sound, the match inevitably turns into something many find undesirable. Well done Xen. I’ve been waiting for someone to get this close.

    There should be more than one hero mode but we ain’t getting that.

    Waiting for someone to state the obvious? Yes the mode is exploitable, and that's why we want them to fix it. Just because DICE said it's getting replaced is no reason not to continue to advocate for them to add an additional mode. They also said we would be getting the new mode as a trial event, and did that happen?

    Yes it'll be cool to try out a new mode, just like it was with Hero Showdown or with Hero Starfighters, for a few matches.... We see how those turned out.
    ZI7BNkU.gif
    ^Maximum the Hormone - Alien^
    (Sorta like an insane Japanese SOAD, but w/ 3 vocalists and slap bass)

    Gamertag: Billkwando YouTube: Billkwando
    Find me in HvV, pushing people off of stuff and watching them fall, like a cat.
  • Billkwando wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.

    Lmao *strategy and intelligence

    * alt-tab to youtube, find all the glitch spots and have our Maul run/hide in them while we kill ourselves repeatedly to give him the target every time. Have our Boba respawn cheese his cooldowns to rocket barrage their target every 5 seconds. Switch to Lightside, Luke or Yoda takes over the role of Maul while Anakin gets a dedicated suicide bot to charge his Retribution to full 3 or 4 times every minute and grind the enemy team to dust.

    I can do, but simply don't wish to be forced to play that way by a bad ruleset just to beat down on horrible players doing the same. It's boring and exposes how poor a state the game's mechanics are in.


    TDM may be simple but at least it isn't actively promoting garbage respawn scumming and exploits as the optimal meta.

    I acknowledge this. This is the counter argument. The valid one. You can deal with runners and win, but what it takes to do so becomes a cat and mouse game. While all of this is tactically sound, the match inevitably turns into something many find undesirable. Well done Xen. I’ve been waiting for someone to get this close.

    There should be more than one hero mode but we ain’t getting that.

    Waiting for someone to state the obvious? Yes the mode is exploitable, and that's why we want them to fix it. Just because DICE said it's getting replaced is no reason not to continue to advocate for them to add an additional mode. They also said we would be getting the new mode as a trial event, and did that happen?

    Yes it'll be cool to try out a new mode, just like it was with Hero Showdown or with Hero Starfighters, for a few matches.... We see how those turned out.

    I has hopes from way back that TDM would be a new mode, and then we could lobby to get HvV tweaked. TDM was necessary to appease many.

    So much for that. These Swedish boys operate from a different perspective than I can figure out.
  • KZ_Toxic
    267 posts Member
    edited May 14
    The last game, (bf15), was basically team death match, it just had that one interesting aspect of if you die you don’t come back as a hero. That along with the time limit was genius imo. I’m not sure how this new mode will work with quick respawns, may be awesome, may suck, just have to wait and see. I feel like both modes will have their share of runners though.

    That's why that mode was complete trash. In regard to not respawning as a hero...You can't get better at playing a hero when you're dead relatively quick. The current HvV is ok, but the target system is not the best. I personally prefer what's coming only cause I spent so much time playing the original BF. Tho I'm sure it'll have its own inherent problems as does any mode on this game. One thing in think will be interesting is the use of different cards are likely. You'll see people using health regen cards more im betting.
  • KresusFIN
    2716 posts Member
    Liz4rD wrote: »
    KresusFIN wrote: »
    Liz4rD wrote: »
    KresusFIN wrote: »
    OcDoc wrote: »
    Hero Blast only HELPS the runner issue and doesn’t even stop it and at the expense of entertainment value and the promotion of camping. I can’t support that.

    Runners now: Never contribute to teamfights. Still end up ensuring his team wins games because he was trash. Screws over an opposition that is obviously better than his team.

    Runners in TDM: You're literally only shooting yourself in the foot. Take part. Or don't. You no longer get to gift free points / victories to your team by running away and having the target whittled down.

    You have and incredible ability for not imagine things. Imagine Im Maul. I can run faster than anyone and make 15 metres jumps to make the gap even bigger between me and any chaser. I can even mantain ppl away with my force push. I run and run and in my third passing I saw a Yoda low on health, I rush and make the final blow. 1 free kill for me. I run away and hide in a corner, turn off my saber for its glowing not to reveal my position. Then again Yoda is near, and unaware of my pressence. He is low on health again because he just confronted Vader and got his *** seriously kicked. I run, jump, dash, two passings and hes dead. I run and return to my hiding or continue running around the map in the hope of finding another unaware player low on health. Will anyone chase Maul? In TM ppl chased Maul just because he was a target, but when Maul was not the target he usually did this tactic. Now in TDM he will use this tactic over and over again, and no one will want to chase him, because he is too fast and it is dangerous, he got all the advantage.

    How will TDM end the runner strategy? Running will be an effective strategy to get kills for a Luke or a Maul. Tell them that TDM wont allow this. And hear their laughter.

    It will allow it just fine. That Maul just will not get to decide the outcome of a match all by himself.

    Run all you want. Nobody will chase you, and instead the folks on the Maul's team will only feed the opposition tickets, being down a man for teamfights all the time.

    The scenario is literally like I described it: "You no longer get to gift free points / victories to your team by running away, and your 3 other teammates slowly whittle down the opposing target."

    When everyone becomes a "target" (Which is really what TDM does), nobody will bother chasing a runner, because it's that much easier to fight and kill the people that actually play the game, rather than play tag with some weirdo not having any business in the mode to begin with.

    You are not getting the point at all. Maul can run and KILL with ease. No one will stop him and that will make him maybe deciding the outcome of a match. He is a HIT AND RUN character, you see?

    Everyone is not a target. Everyone counts if he or she is killed. Its NOT THE SAME. because characters are not designed to be balanced. So maybe that one who are the fastest got an advantage. And those in disadvantage wont fight them. So the 'TARGET' sign over Maul's head is smaller than other players'.

    A Maul used to running all match will never conciously make the decision to run into a full group. He'll get CC'd, and pulled back in when he makes his escape.

    And if he does actually stick around long enough to do any damage, he'll die for his troubles. "Hit and Run" strats are only valid if they take a sizable chunk away from someone's permahealth. Maul will never do that against a full team. Not by himself, anyway.

    Why anyone would pick Maul when Vader and Kylo have both superior CC and Damage output to begin with is beyond me even then.

    Maul will never be the deciding outcome of a match in TDM. He already fulfills that role just fine in RunnerReward. When analyzed for his fighting capability, he's just unimpressive. Compared to the other original two.
    Heart of darkness beateth, Ultima
    Iron enigma treateth, Ultima
    Shielding light retreateth, Ultima
    Hydaelyn defeated. Ah, Ultima


    The fact is that if you're running it's because you suck, and the game shouldn't pander to players who suck.

    y6qvidach2x9.png

    "I have never died to a Finn"
  • Billkwando wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.

    Lmao *strategy and intelligence

    * alt-tab to youtube, find all the glitch spots and have our Maul run/hide in them while we kill ourselves repeatedly to give him the target every time. Have our Boba respawn cheese his cooldowns to rocket barrage their target every 5 seconds. Switch to Lightside, Luke or Yoda takes over the role of Maul while Anakin gets a dedicated suicide bot to charge his Retribution to full 3 or 4 times every minute and grind the enemy team to dust.

    I can do, but simply don't wish to be forced to play that way by a bad ruleset just to beat down on horrible players doing the same. It's boring and exposes how poor a state the game's mechanics are in.


    TDM may be simple but at least it isn't actively promoting garbage respawn scumming and exploits as the optimal meta.

    I acknowledge this. This is the counter argument. The valid one. You can deal with runners and win, but what it takes to do so becomes a cat and mouse game. While all of this is tactically sound, the match inevitably turns into something many find undesirable. Well done Xen. I’ve been waiting for someone to get this close.

    There should be more than one hero mode but we ain’t getting that.

    Waiting for someone to state the obvious? Yes the mode is exploitable, and that's why we want them to fix it. Just because DICE said it's getting replaced is no reason not to continue to advocate for them to add an additional mode. They also said we would be getting the new mode as a trial event, and did that happen?

    Yes it'll be cool to try out a new mode, just like it was with Hero Showdown or with Hero Starfighters, for a few matches.... We see how those turned out.
    Hero Showdown and Hero Starfighters are very poorly designed modes. The delay between rounds is stupid. The fact that you have to wait for even teams when someone quits is more stupid.

    If they make this new HvV function like those modes then the change wouldn’t be worth it and I would quit the game. If it’s just regular TDM, then it shouldn’t be compared to those modes.
  • Nothing is worse than keeping the toxic targetting system around. Removing it will force players to actually get good and learn to fight for themselves. I literally played a match with a darth maul who did nothing else but run away when he was the target. He ran in circles around the map and meanwhile our target had to fend for themselves because they weren't a coward. I messaged the maul and he said "that's how you win".... If that is seriously the best method for survival in HvV then it is WROOOOOOOONG. Get good and fight to win. Can't wait for Hero Blast.

    But don’t you see? It’s not the best method. It only works if your opponents are potatoes.
  • quenaelin wrote: »
    That is what I like about Target System you have more tactical choices like in reality. You can camp or flee to win, more powerful opponent doesn't always win, call it cowardness or cleverness if you like. Though I don't like map glitch hiders, target timer would solve that problem.
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    I forgot to mention too (and I have video evidence to back it up) yesterday I played 3 HvV matches and in two of them there was a quitter in the other team. Both games lasted more than ten minutes without a replacement joining to fill their 4th. This was at 6PM on US east coast on Virginia servers. If there are indeed thousands upon thousands trying to play why then during a prime time hour on an extremely populated server was there not a single person found to fill the spot?

    The problem is that Dice matchmaking for this game is really bad. They have attempted to fix it once. It only improved slightly, so that people could join the same team if they were partied up. However, they haven't done anything else with it since then and it has tons of problems.


    People in here are FOOLISH if they thing changing HvV target to Hero Blast will change anything with the game mode. Hero Blast will be a huge pile of garbage still because the main two issues aren't being addressed with Target system. Those two issues are:
    1. Spawning and spawn points still spawn killed team members at opposite corners of the map. Making it hard to cross the map and rejoin the team without encountering the enemy team.
    2. Matchmaking in this game still sucks because it stacks the team typically with a lot of new people on one side and the experienced players on the other side. Give everyone a rank for each game mode based on how much they play or what rank they get overall in the game. This will be a "moving average rank" so that the last 10-20 games they played determine your overall rank. The rank is based on your overall scoreboard rank for each game. It should be a moving average of the scoreboard ranks, so that it takes into consideration how much you were doing the objective and killing enemies. All it needs to be moving average so that it adjusts with how you are playing. Scoreboard rank is a really quick and easy way to determine that without having to add more coding for determining people's rank some other way. Then in modes like HvV the game can balance the game as best as possible by ensuring that the average team rank is pretty close to each other. Or come up with something similar to this.

    The issue is that everyone thinks that the target mode itself is the problem. That is far from actuality. The real problem was when it would select the new target and the above two issues. If dice would have adjusted when it selected the target, so that 3/4 people had to be alive or wait until they were alive to do so. Then you wouldn't get a lot of these easy kills where it selected the new character

    Also any experienced team knows that while runners can be irritating, teamwork will stop a runner all the time. The game mode is quite fun and would work much better if they would have just fixed these issues.

    People keep going on and on about how every enconter will matter in Hero Blast, which is a highly laughable statement. The only encounters that will really matter are between the experienced and the new players. As the new players will die much more often and the game will boil down to whichever side has more of the new players. People will continue to leave the game because of this and I suspect that they will start leaving Hero Blast at a much higher rate than they are now in HvV because of this major imbalance issue. The final thing that people fail to realize is that the target system is there, so that new players are able to die more often than the rest of the team without completely ruining the game mode for everyone else. If the new people die more often than they are less likely to be the target and the more experienced players will become the target.
    People like you always defend the target system but it boils down to the same thing with different wordage. You are advocating for participation trophies. It stands within perfect reason that if team A is good experienced players and team B has new low skill gamers then of course team A will win and they should. If team B are bad players and they can win it means one of two things, either team B isn’t actually bad players, or the game design is flawed that gives wins to players that it shouldn’t.

    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    You are wrong. Truth is, you may not have ever been more wrong in you life.

    I’ll preface this by saying that those who use wall glitches to hide should all burn in... Well you get the idea.

    If your “perfect reason” description were actually true, the world would be a completely different place. This is basic combat tactics 101. When confronted with a superior force, be it numbers, or for our purposes skill, the lesser force must employ alternative tactics to win. The superior force will not, nor should not always win. Speed and maneuverability, and the breaking of the accepted(or in our case, desired) rules of engagement.

    It’s been said that a runner allows the remaining three on his team to slowly whittle down a superior team and get the point. This is true. It’s incumbent on the superior(more powerful) team to adapt to this tactic or be defeated. Calling this cowardly is a lazy excuse for getting defeated by choices instead of thumbs on controllers.

    Here are some real world historical examples.

    - Without the application of cowardly tactics, the United States would never have beaten the British in the Revolutionary War. Had they not learned to not just line up on the battlefield, and instead employ hit and run tactics when necessary, we would have lost. We almost learned too late. The British called them cowards for fighting this way. Washington crossed the Potomac River in the dead of winter to take the enemy by surprise. He was breaking the standard rules of engagement and using the terrain to his advantage. The British branded him cowardly... among other things.

    -At the Thrilla in Manila, Muhammed Ali ran from George Foreman for over three quarters of the match. Straight up ran... in boxing terms. He used the ropes(terrain) to his advantage with speed and maneuvering while conserving stamina. George, a beast of a man in his prime, should have won but was tired-out and psychology frustrated by this tactic. This was Ali in his thirties, after being out of boxing for several years. He was the inferior force of the two. It was termed rope-a-dope. No one called him a coward though, but he was credited with superior tactics. The Sweet Science.

    -Long ago 300 Spartans stood against Xerxes and a Persian army that they claim was a million strong. They used the mountain pass named Thermopylae to render the Persian numbers meaningless. They used terrain in such a fashion that some would call a it map exploit. (This is not the same as wall glitches. There are no terrain glitches in the real world) But it is the same as many things players in this game do that inconveniences opponents of superior skill. Unlike the British, the Persians adapted. They used another mountain pass to get behind the Spartans.

    -The Mujahideen Afghans vs the Russians in the 80’s.
    -The Viet-Cong vs the US.
    -General Patton vs Rommel in WWII.

    I could go on endlessly but you get the idea. These lesser forces were able to accomplish much more than they should have been able to because of tactics which were designed to thwart a superior force.

    They were all called cowards by the defeated.

    A superior force should win, but victory is, always has been, and always will be more than just who has the most power(skill).

    Now, I understand that a different ruleset would change the way matches would play. I also understand that some folks would appreciate a more basic playing field where the fella who’d win in a 1v1 through simple twitch reflexes would also translate into a 4v4. TDM will go along way towards that. Just don’t think for one second that the target system is intrinsically flawed because a lesser force can upset a greater one. That mentality has been the downfall of many more powerful(skilled) forces since the beginning of combat.

    The target system is almost gone. Whatever we get, don’t be surprised if some meta tactic arises for a lesser group to defeat a greater one. And this time around, adjust your own strategy before trying to change the rules again.

    @Darth_Vapor3 Well said. This is fantastic. It'll fall on deaf ears, however. I kinda feel this whole issue stems from individuals who just can't stand being bested, so they wish to take away the mode and restart it with another. Who really wants the participation trophies here? Otherwise, why would they care so much if the targeting system was left available in the game. Just don't play it.
    I'm very much looking forward to playing tdm/hb. Sounds like loads of fun! At the same time, I really enjoy playing the target system with my mates, and would like to be able to continue doing so.

    Deaf ears... There’s no doubt.

    I will crush you and we both know it! How dare you not stand still and make it easier for me! You are disrupting the natural order you coward!

    Lol. Please...
  • UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    I forgot to mention too (and I have video evidence to back it up) yesterday I played 3 HvV matches and in two of them there was a quitter in the other team. Both games lasted more than ten minutes without a replacement joining to fill their 4th. This was at 6PM on US east coast on Virginia servers. If there are indeed thousands upon thousands trying to play why then during a prime time hour on an extremely populated server was there not a single person found to fill the spot?

    The problem is that Dice matchmaking for this game is really bad. They have attempted to fix it once. It only improved slightly, so that people could join the same team if they were partied up. However, they haven't done anything else with it since then and it has tons of problems.


    People in here are FOOLISH if they thing changing HvV target to Hero Blast will change anything with the game mode. Hero Blast will be a huge pile of garbage still because the main two issues aren't being addressed with Target system. Those two issues are:
    1. Spawning and spawn points still spawn killed team members at opposite corners of the map. Making it hard to cross the map and rejoin the team without encountering the enemy team.
    2. Matchmaking in this game still sucks because it stacks the team typically with a lot of new people on one side and the experienced players on the other side. Give everyone a rank for each game mode based on how much they play or what rank they get overall in the game. This will be a "moving average rank" so that the last 10-20 games they played determine your overall rank. The rank is based on your overall scoreboard rank for each game. It should be a moving average of the scoreboard ranks, so that it takes into consideration how much you were doing the objective and killing enemies. All it needs to be moving average so that it adjusts with how you are playing. Scoreboard rank is a really quick and easy way to determine that without having to add more coding for determining people's rank some other way. Then in modes like HvV the game can balance the game as best as possible by ensuring that the average team rank is pretty close to each other. Or come up with something similar to this.

    The issue is that everyone thinks that the target mode itself is the problem. That is far from actuality. The real problem was when it would select the new target and the above two issues. If dice would have adjusted when it selected the target, so that 3/4 people had to be alive or wait until they were alive to do so. Then you wouldn't get a lot of these easy kills where it selected the new character

    Also any experienced team knows that while runners can be irritating, teamwork will stop a runner all the time. The game mode is quite fun and would work much better if they would have just fixed these issues.

    People keep going on and on about how every enconter will matter in Hero Blast, which is a highly laughable statement. The only encounters that will really matter are between the experienced and the new players. As the new players will die much more often and the game will boil down to whichever side has more of the new players. People will continue to leave the game because of this and I suspect that they will start leaving Hero Blast at a much higher rate than they are now in HvV because of this major imbalance issue. The final thing that people fail to realize is that the target system is there, so that new players are able to die more often than the rest of the team without completely ruining the game mode for everyone else. If the new people die more often than they are less likely to be the target and the more experienced players will become the target.
    People like you always defend the target system but it boils down to the same thing with different wordage. You are advocating for participation trophies. It stands within perfect reason that if team A is good experienced players and team B has new low skill gamers then of course team A will win and they should. If team B are bad players and they can win it means one of two things, either team B isn’t actually bad players, or the game design is flawed that gives wins to players that it shouldn’t.

    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    You are wrong. Truth is, you may not have ever been more wrong in you life.

    I’ll preface this by saying that those who use wall glitches to hide should all burn in... Well you get the idea.

    If your “perfect reason” description were actually true, the world would be a completely different place. This is basic combat tactics 101. When confronted with a superior force, be it numbers, or for our purposes skill, the lesser force must employ alternative tactics to win. The superior force will not, nor should not always win. Speed and maneuverability, and the breaking of the accepted(or in our case, desired) rules of engagement.

    It’s been said that a runner allows the remaining three on his team to slowly whittle down a superior team and get the point. This is true. It’s incumbent on the superior(more powerful) team to adapt to this tactic or be defeated. Calling this cowardly is a lazy excuse for getting defeated by choices instead of thumbs on controllers.

    Here are some real world historical examples.

    - Without the application of cowardly tactics, the United States would never have beaten the British in the Revolutionary War. Had they not learned to not just line up on the battlefield, and instead employ hit and run tactics when necessary, we would have lost. We almost learned too late. The British called them cowards for fighting this way. Washington crossed the Potomac River in the dead of winter to take the enemy by surprise. He was breaking the standard rules of engagement and using the terrain to his advantage. The British branded him cowardly... among other things.

    -At the Thrilla in Manila, Muhammed Ali ran from George Foreman for over three quarters of the match. Straight up ran... in boxing terms. He used the ropes(terrain) to his advantage with speed and maneuvering while conserving stamina. George, a beast of a man in his prime, should have won but was tired-out and psychology frustrated by this tactic. This was Ali in his thirties, after being out of boxing for several years. He was the inferior force of the two. It was termed rope-a-dope. No one called him a coward though, but he was credited with superior tactics. The Sweet Science.

    -Long ago 300 Spartans stood against Xerxes and a Persian army that they claim was a million strong. They used the mountain pass named Thermopylae to render the Persian numbers meaningless. They used terrain in such a fashion that some would call a it map exploit. (This is not the same as wall glitches. There are no terrain glitches in the real world) But it is the same as many things players in this game do that inconveniences opponents of superior skill. Unlike the British, the Persians adapted. They used another mountain pass to get behind the Spartans.

    -The Mujahideen Afghans vs the Russians in the 80’s.
    -The Viet-Cong vs the US.
    -General Patton vs Rommel in WWII.

    I could go on endlessly but you get the idea. These lesser forces were able to accomplish much more than they should have been able to because of tactics which were designed to thwart a superior force.

    They were all called cowards by the defeated.

    A superior force should win, but victory is, always has been, and always will be more than just who has the most power(skill).

    Now, I understand that a different ruleset would change the way matches would play. I also understand that some folks would appreciate a more basic playing field where the fella who’d win in a 1v1 through simple twitch reflexes would also translate into a 4v4. TDM will go along way towards that. Just don’t think for one second that the target system is intrinsically flawed because a lesser force can upset a greater one. That mentality has been the downfall of many more powerful(skilled) forces since the beginning of combat.

    The target system is almost gone. Whatever we get, don’t be surprised if some meta tactic arises for a lesser group to defeat a greater one. And this time around, adjust your own strategy before trying to change the rules again.
    I stopped reading less than halfway thru. Here’s is the biggest flaw and your very own defeat. You only equate “more skilled gamers” to being superior with the use of a controller. Yes having quick reaction time and high dexterity does allow a skilled player to emerge. But that’s not the only thing that makes players skilled. Wits, tactics, planning, positioning all contribute to a dominant players arsenal. Think of it like madden. You have a quarterback with 99 speed, wow that’s fast. But his throw accuracy and power are rated at 50. His overall rating would be idk let’s say 60. Now take another quarterback his speed is only 70 but his throw accuracy and power is 70. That makes him rated a 70 overall and the better quarterback. I mean it can get deeper too like depending on how the coaches use said QBs can determine the fate of the game but you get he picture.

    See that’s what you target lovers don’t get. It’s the abuse of the target system and using the spawns and respawning for fresh health and abilities that we don’t like. You purposefully avoid fighting in order to win. You’ve had your way for over a year and a half now. I hope it’s amounted you many many wins. Now it’s our turn. If hero blast comes out and the runner I played against yesterday is my opponent again and he wins, then I’ll admit defeat to a superior player. I’ll take a long hard look at whether I’m even as good as I think I am. Now, hopefully, it’s us slayers’ turns to use the tactics we wanna use in blast mode if that’s what it ends up being.
  • Billkwando
    1644 posts Member
    edited May 14
    Billkwando wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.

    Lmao *strategy and intelligence

    * alt-tab to youtube, find all the glitch spots and have our Maul run/hide in them while we kill ourselves repeatedly to give him the target every time. Have our Boba respawn cheese his cooldowns to rocket barrage their target every 5 seconds. Switch to Lightside, Luke or Yoda takes over the role of Maul while Anakin gets a dedicated suicide bot to charge his Retribution to full 3 or 4 times every minute and grind the enemy team to dust.

    I can do, but simply don't wish to be forced to play that way by a bad ruleset just to beat down on horrible players doing the same. It's boring and exposes how poor a state the game's mechanics are in.


    TDM may be simple but at least it isn't actively promoting garbage respawn scumming and exploits as the optimal meta.

    I acknowledge this. This is the counter argument. The valid one. You can deal with runners and win, but what it takes to do so becomes a cat and mouse game. While all of this is tactically sound, the match inevitably turns into something many find undesirable. Well done Xen. I’ve been waiting for someone to get this close.

    There should be more than one hero mode but we ain’t getting that.

    Waiting for someone to state the obvious? Yes the mode is exploitable, and that's why we want them to fix it. Just because DICE said it's getting replaced is no reason not to continue to advocate for them to add an additional mode. They also said we would be getting the new mode as a trial event, and did that happen?

    Yes it'll be cool to try out a new mode, just like it was with Hero Showdown or with Hero Starfighters, for a few matches.... We see how those turned out.
    Hero Showdown and Hero Starfighters are very poorly designed modes. The delay between rounds is stupid. The fact that you have to wait for even teams when someone quits is more stupid.

    If they make this new HvV function like those modes then the change wouldn’t be worth it and I would quit the game. If it’s just regular TDM, then it shouldn’t be compared to those modes.

    As usual, the point flew right over your head, but that's ok, because you're on to something. We shouldn't have to quit the game over a bad mode. They should add the new mode alongside the current mode, so we have a choice. However, beyond the "shouldn't be compared" part, everything else you said, I totally agree with. It's a shame that those are basically wasted modes, and either of them could be easily replaced with the new TDM, leaving DICE all the time in the world to tinker with making the target system better, and you guys, that don't like it, still won't have to play it. It's a win-win.
    ZI7BNkU.gif
    ^Maximum the Hormone - Alien^
    (Sorta like an insane Japanese SOAD, but w/ 3 vocalists and slap bass)

    Gamertag: Billkwando YouTube: Billkwando
    Find me in HvV, pushing people off of stuff and watching them fall, like a cat.
  • rollind24
    5388 posts Member
    Billkwando wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.

    Lmao *strategy and intelligence

    * alt-tab to youtube, find all the glitch spots and have our Maul run/hide in them while we kill ourselves repeatedly to give him the target every time. Have our Boba respawn cheese his cooldowns to rocket barrage their target every 5 seconds. Switch to Lightside, Luke or Yoda takes over the role of Maul while Anakin gets a dedicated suicide bot to charge his Retribution to full 3 or 4 times every minute and grind the enemy team to dust.

    I can do, but simply don't wish to be forced to play that way by a bad ruleset just to beat down on horrible players doing the same. It's boring and exposes how poor a state the game's mechanics are in.


    TDM may be simple but at least it isn't actively promoting garbage respawn scumming and exploits as the optimal meta.

    I acknowledge this. This is the counter argument. The valid one. You can deal with runners and win, but what it takes to do so becomes a cat and mouse game. While all of this is tactically sound, the match inevitably turns into something many find undesirable. Well done Xen. I’ve been waiting for someone to get this close.

    There should be more than one hero mode but we ain’t getting that.

    Waiting for someone to state the obvious? Yes the mode is exploitable, and that's why we want them to fix it. Just because DICE said it's getting replaced is no reason not to continue to advocate for them to add an additional mode. They also said we would be getting the new mode as a trial event, and did that happen?

    Yes it'll be cool to try out a new mode, just like it was with Hero Showdown or with Hero Starfighters, for a few matches.... We see how those turned out.
    Hero Showdown and Hero Starfighters are very poorly designed modes. The delay between rounds is stupid. The fact that you have to wait for even teams when someone quits is more stupid.

    If they make this new HvV function like those modes then the change wouldn’t be worth it and I would quit the game. If it’s just regular TDM, then it shouldn’t be compared to those modes.

    As usual, the point flew right over your head, but that's ok, because you're on to something. We shouldn't have to quit the game over a bad mode. They should add the new mode alongside the current mode, so we have a choice. However, beyond the "shouldn't be compared" part, everything else you said, I totally agree with. It's a shame that those are basically wasted modes, and either of them could be easily replaced with the new TDM, leaving DICE all the time in the world to tinker with making the target system better, and you guys, that don't like it, still won't have to play it. It's a win-win.

    Hero Starfighters was a colossal waste of time created to help players level up their Hero starships after nonstop whining. Two flaws, the easier route would have been to reduce the points needed to level them up. 2nd if players were unable to attain Hero Starfighters in SA what would be the point of having a maxed out ship in the first place?
    #infantrylivesmatter
  • UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    I forgot to mention too (and I have video evidence to back it up) yesterday I played 3 HvV matches and in two of them there was a quitter in the other team. Both games lasted more than ten minutes without a replacement joining to fill their 4th. This was at 6PM on US east coast on Virginia servers. If there are indeed thousands upon thousands trying to play why then during a prime time hour on an extremely populated server was there not a single person found to fill the spot?

    The problem is that Dice matchmaking for this game is really bad. They have attempted to fix it once. It only improved slightly, so that people could join the same team if they were partied up. However, they haven't done anything else with it since then and it has tons of problems.


    People in here are FOOLISH if they thing changing HvV target to Hero Blast will change anything with the game mode. Hero Blast will be a huge pile of garbage still because the main two issues aren't being addressed with Target system. Those two issues are:
    1. Spawning and spawn points still spawn killed team members at opposite corners of the map. Making it hard to cross the map and rejoin the team without encountering the enemy team.
    2. Matchmaking in this game still sucks because it stacks the team typically with a lot of new people on one side and the experienced players on the other side. Give everyone a rank for each game mode based on how much they play or what rank they get overall in the game. This will be a "moving average rank" so that the last 10-20 games they played determine your overall rank. The rank is based on your overall scoreboard rank for each game. It should be a moving average of the scoreboard ranks, so that it takes into consideration how much you were doing the objective and killing enemies. All it needs to be moving average so that it adjusts with how you are playing. Scoreboard rank is a really quick and easy way to determine that without having to add more coding for determining people's rank some other way. Then in modes like HvV the game can balance the game as best as possible by ensuring that the average team rank is pretty close to each other. Or come up with something similar to this.

    The issue is that everyone thinks that the target mode itself is the problem. That is far from actuality. The real problem was when it would select the new target and the above two issues. If dice would have adjusted when it selected the target, so that 3/4 people had to be alive or wait until they were alive to do so. Then you wouldn't get a lot of these easy kills where it selected the new character

    Also any experienced team knows that while runners can be irritating, teamwork will stop a runner all the time. The game mode is quite fun and would work much better if they would have just fixed these issues.

    People keep going on and on about how every enconter will matter in Hero Blast, which is a highly laughable statement. The only encounters that will really matter are between the experienced and the new players. As the new players will die much more often and the game will boil down to whichever side has more of the new players. People will continue to leave the game because of this and I suspect that they will start leaving Hero Blast at a much higher rate than they are now in HvV because of this major imbalance issue. The final thing that people fail to realize is that the target system is there, so that new players are able to die more often than the rest of the team without completely ruining the game mode for everyone else. If the new people die more often than they are less likely to be the target and the more experienced players will become the target.
    People like you always defend the target system but it boils down to the same thing with different wordage. You are advocating for participation trophies. It stands within perfect reason that if team A is good experienced players and team B has new low skill gamers then of course team A will win and they should. If team B are bad players and they can win it means one of two things, either team B isn’t actually bad players, or the game design is flawed that gives wins to players that it shouldn’t.

    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    You are wrong. Truth is, you may not have ever been more wrong in you life.

    I’ll preface this by saying that those who use wall glitches to hide should all burn in... Well you get the idea.

    If your “perfect reason” description were actually true, the world would be a completely different place. This is basic combat tactics 101. When confronted with a superior force, be it numbers, or for our purposes skill, the lesser force must employ alternative tactics to win. The superior force will not, nor should not always win. Speed and maneuverability, and the breaking of the accepted(or in our case, desired) rules of engagement.

    It’s been said that a runner allows the remaining three on his team to slowly whittle down a superior team and get the point. This is true. It’s incumbent on the superior(more powerful) team to adapt to this tactic or be defeated. Calling this cowardly is a lazy excuse for getting defeated by choices instead of thumbs on controllers.

    Here are some real world historical examples.

    - Without the application of cowardly tactics, the United States would never have beaten the British in the Revolutionary War. Had they not learned to not just line up on the battlefield, and instead employ hit and run tactics when necessary, we would have lost. We almost learned too late. The British called them cowards for fighting this way. Washington crossed the Potomac River in the dead of winter to take the enemy by surprise. He was breaking the standard rules of engagement and using the terrain to his advantage. The British branded him cowardly... among other things.

    -At the Thrilla in Manila, Muhammed Ali ran from George Foreman for over three quarters of the match. Straight up ran... in boxing terms. He used the ropes(terrain) to his advantage with speed and maneuvering while conserving stamina. George, a beast of a man in his prime, should have won but was tired-out and psychology frustrated by this tactic. This was Ali in his thirties, after being out of boxing for several years. He was the inferior force of the two. It was termed rope-a-dope. No one called him a coward though, but he was credited with superior tactics. The Sweet Science.

    -Long ago 300 Spartans stood against Xerxes and a Persian army that they claim was a million strong. They used the mountain pass named Thermopylae to render the Persian numbers meaningless. They used terrain in such a fashion that some would call a it map exploit. (This is not the same as wall glitches. There are no terrain glitches in the real world) But it is the same as many things players in this game do that inconveniences opponents of superior skill. Unlike the British, the Persians adapted. They used another mountain pass to get behind the Spartans.

    -The Mujahideen Afghans vs the Russians in the 80’s.
    -The Viet-Cong vs the US.
    -General Patton vs Rommel in WWII.

    I could go on endlessly but you get the idea. These lesser forces were able to accomplish much more than they should have been able to because of tactics which were designed to thwart a superior force.

    They were all called cowards by the defeated.

    A superior force should win, but victory is, always has been, and always will be more than just who has the most power(skill).

    Now, I understand that a different ruleset would change the way matches would play. I also understand that some folks would appreciate a more basic playing field where the fella who’d win in a 1v1 through simple twitch reflexes would also translate into a 4v4. TDM will go along way towards that. Just don’t think for one second that the target system is intrinsically flawed because a lesser force can upset a greater one. That mentality has been the downfall of many more powerful(skilled) forces since the beginning of combat.

    The target system is almost gone. Whatever we get, don’t be surprised if some meta tactic arises for a lesser group to defeat a greater one. And this time around, adjust your own strategy before trying to change the rules again.
    I stopped reading less than halfway thru. Here’s is the biggest flaw and your very own defeat. You only equate “more skilled gamers” to being superior with the use of a controller. Yes having quick reaction time and high dexterity does allow a skilled player to emerge. But that’s not the only thing that makes players skilled. Wits, tactics, planning, positioning all contribute to a dominant players arsenal. Think of it like madden. You have a quarterback with 99 speed, wow that’s fast. But his throw accuracy and power are rated at 50. His overall rating would be idk let’s say 60. Now take another quarterback his speed is only 70 but his throw accuracy and power is 70. That makes him rated a 70 overall and the better quarterback. I mean it can get deeper too like depending on how the coaches use said QBs can determine the fate of the game but you get he picture.
    Of course you stopped reading, who would have expected otherwise.

    Your bolded sentence above is a reiteration of my entire post. Thank you for the public acknowledgment.

    I’ve played Madden since it began in 1988. I played it heavily for about 20 years. I’ve won more madden games than you, and everyone that you know, have even played. Thank you for bringing that game here for analogy purposes.
    An accurate passer will stay in the pocket and throw. A less accurate passer with a high speed will... wait for it.... run. Thank you again.
    See that’s what you target lovers don’t get. It’s the abuse of the target system and using the spawns and respawning for fresh health and abilities that we don’t like. You purposefully avoid fighting in order to win. You’ve had your way for over a year and a half now. I hope it’s amounted you many many wins. Now it’s our turn. If hero blast comes out and the runner I played against yesterday is my opponent again and he wins, then I’ll admit defeat to a superior player. I’ll take a long hard look at whether I’m even as good as I think I am. Now, hopefully, it’s us slayers’ turns to use the tactics we wanna use in blast mode if that’s what it ends up being.
    You are quite the gem. I appreciate all that you are doing here. You cannot abuse the target system by utilizing speed and maneuverability. That’s analogous to saying your abusing the passing system by using play actions and read options.

    My defeat? What an interesting sentiment. Though I suspect without even realizing it, you have already conceded. By expanding your premise to now include spawning and respawning exploits, you are admitting that your original position doesn’t stand on it’s own. This is also analogous to repositioning. Again, gratitude for the validation.

    Respawning to avoid death and reset abilities is cheating. Just like wall glitches.

    Then you actually state this,
    “You’ve had your way for over a year and a half now. I hope it’s amounted you many many wins. Now it’s our turn.”
    The...”It’s my turn, it’s my turn” argument? That’s embarrassing I it’s own right without my help. Suffice to say that the child in you has emerged.

    Lastly, take it easy on yourself. No long hard looks necessary. Your going to win some and lose some. We all do.
  • Liz4rD
    973 posts Member
    KresusFIN wrote: »
    Liz4rD wrote: »
    KresusFIN wrote: »
    Liz4rD wrote: »
    KresusFIN wrote: »
    OcDoc wrote: »
    Hero Blast only HELPS the runner issue and doesn’t even stop it and at the expense of entertainment value and the promotion of camping. I can’t support that.

    Runners now: Never contribute to teamfights. Still end up ensuring his team wins games because he was trash. Screws over an opposition that is obviously better than his team.

    Runners in TDM: You're literally only shooting yourself in the foot. Take part. Or don't. You no longer get to gift free points / victories to your team by running away and having the target whittled down.

    You have and incredible ability for not imagine things. Imagine Im Maul. I can run faster than anyone and make 15 metres jumps to make the gap even bigger between me and any chaser. I can even mantain ppl away with my force push. I run and run and in my third passing I saw a Yoda low on health, I rush and make the final blow. 1 free kill for me. I run away and hide in a corner, turn off my saber for its glowing not to reveal my position. Then again Yoda is near, and unaware of my pressence. He is low on health again because he just confronted Vader and got his *** seriously kicked. I run, jump, dash, two passings and hes dead. I run and return to my hiding or continue running around the map in the hope of finding another unaware player low on health. Will anyone chase Maul? In TM ppl chased Maul just because he was a target, but when Maul was not the target he usually did this tactic. Now in TDM he will use this tactic over and over again, and no one will want to chase him, because he is too fast and it is dangerous, he got all the advantage.

    How will TDM end the runner strategy? Running will be an effective strategy to get kills for a Luke or a Maul. Tell them that TDM wont allow this. And hear their laughter.

    It will allow it just fine. That Maul just will not get to decide the outcome of a match all by himself.

    Run all you want. Nobody will chase you, and instead the folks on the Maul's team will only feed the opposition tickets, being down a man for teamfights all the time.

    The scenario is literally like I described it: "You no longer get to gift free points / victories to your team by running away, and your 3 other teammates slowly whittle down the opposing target."

    When everyone becomes a "target" (Which is really what TDM does), nobody will bother chasing a runner, because it's that much easier to fight and kill the people that actually play the game, rather than play tag with some weirdo not having any business in the mode to begin with.

    You are not getting the point at all. Maul can run and KILL with ease. No one will stop him and that will make him maybe deciding the outcome of a match. He is a HIT AND RUN character, you see?

    Everyone is not a target. Everyone counts if he or she is killed. Its NOT THE SAME. because characters are not designed to be balanced. So maybe that one who are the fastest got an advantage. And those in disadvantage wont fight them. So the 'TARGET' sign over Maul's head is smaller than other players'.

    A Maul used to running all match will never conciously make the decision to run into a full group. He'll get CC'd, and pulled back in when he makes his escape.

    And if he does actually stick around long enough to do any damage, he'll die for his troubles. "Hit and Run" strats are only valid if they take a sizable chunk away from someone's permahealth. Maul will never do that against a full team. Not by himself, anyway.

    Why anyone would pick Maul when Vader and Kylo have both superior CC and Damage output to begin with is beyond me even then.

    Maul will never be the deciding outcome of a match in TDM. He already fulfills that role just fine in RunnerReward. When analyzed for his fighting capability, he's just unimpressive. Compared to the other original two.

    Well, Im happy that you come to one of the points Ive made about the new mode: fixed rosters. Players always picking the same characters because players now will think in themselves more than in the group.

    But, that stuff aside, Maul can get kills and not be killed if he play smart his Hit and Run playstyle. And great part of that style is that he is able to put great distance and quickly between him and his enemy. Why I say this? Because it can be seen every day in HvV matches.
  • Liz4rD
    973 posts Member
    Billkwando wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.

    Lmao *strategy and intelligence

    * alt-tab to youtube, find all the glitch spots and have our Maul run/hide in them while we kill ourselves repeatedly to give him the target every time. Have our Boba respawn cheese his cooldowns to rocket barrage their target every 5 seconds. Switch to Lightside, Luke or Yoda takes over the role of Maul while Anakin gets a dedicated suicide bot to charge his Retribution to full 3 or 4 times every minute and grind the enemy team to dust.

    I can do, but simply don't wish to be forced to play that way by a bad ruleset just to beat down on horrible players doing the same. It's boring and exposes how poor a state the game's mechanics are in.


    TDM may be simple but at least it isn't actively promoting garbage respawn scumming and exploits as the optimal meta.

    I acknowledge this. This is the counter argument. The valid one. You can deal with runners and win, but what it takes to do so becomes a cat and mouse game. While all of this is tactically sound, the match inevitably turns into something many find undesirable. Well done Xen. I’ve been waiting for someone to get this close.

    There should be more than one hero mode but we ain’t getting that.

    Waiting for someone to state the obvious? Yes the mode is exploitable, and that's why we want them to fix it. Just because DICE said it's getting replaced is no reason not to continue to advocate for them to add an additional mode. They also said we would be getting the new mode as a trial event, and did that happen?

    Yes it'll be cool to try out a new mode, just like it was with Hero Showdown or with Hero Starfighters, for a few matches.... We see how those turned out.

    I has hopes from way back that TDM would be a new mode, and then we could lobby to get HvV tweaked. TDM was necessary to appease many.

    So much for that. These Swedish boys operate from a different perspective than I can figure out.

    I guess it has to do with the fact of fixing bugs in two modes instead of one. And that game mechanics and back end administration on a TDM arena is way simpler than the target mode. So they make several kills with one shot. They pleased the premade fan base who is willing to confront their testosterone with the random and noob players showing his killing streaks as the only way to measure skill; they simplified a mode and thus save time and efforts because is technically better for them to set a simpler TDM than fix the current TM (and they wont even touch respawn places, etc, sadly) and they will get applause for being LAZY, basically; and at least on the begginning they will attract to the mode a lot of ppl that didnt play TM because it was somewhat difficult for the rookie, then increasing numbers to exhibit as a success in reddit or twitter.
  • Liz4rD wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.
    Billkwando wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    That's not true, but I'll play. Star Wars caters to casuals, so why not allow them to use strategy and intelligence to counter against players who have had months to get good at the game. Why are so many TDM fans such sore losers? That's why so many of them want to change the rules to their advantage.

    Lmao *strategy and intelligence

    * alt-tab to youtube, find all the glitch spots and have our Maul run/hide in them while we kill ourselves repeatedly to give him the target every time. Have our Boba respawn cheese his cooldowns to rocket barrage their target every 5 seconds. Switch to Lightside, Luke or Yoda takes over the role of Maul while Anakin gets a dedicated suicide bot to charge his Retribution to full 3 or 4 times every minute and grind the enemy team to dust.

    I can do, but simply don't wish to be forced to play that way by a bad ruleset just to beat down on horrible players doing the same. It's boring and exposes how poor a state the game's mechanics are in.


    TDM may be simple but at least it isn't actively promoting garbage respawn scumming and exploits as the optimal meta.

    I acknowledge this. This is the counter argument. The valid one. You can deal with runners and win, but what it takes to do so becomes a cat and mouse game. While all of this is tactically sound, the match inevitably turns into something many find undesirable. Well done Xen. I’ve been waiting for someone to get this close.

    There should be more than one hero mode but we ain’t getting that.

    Waiting for someone to state the obvious? Yes the mode is exploitable, and that's why we want them to fix it. Just because DICE said it's getting replaced is no reason not to continue to advocate for them to add an additional mode. They also said we would be getting the new mode as a trial event, and did that happen?

    Yes it'll be cool to try out a new mode, just like it was with Hero Showdown or with Hero Starfighters, for a few matches.... We see how those turned out.

    I has hopes from way back that TDM would be a new mode, and then we could lobby to get HvV tweaked. TDM was necessary to appease many.

    So much for that. These Swedish boys operate from a different perspective than I can figure out.

    I guess it has to do with the fact of fixing bugs in two modes instead of one. And that game mechanics and back end administration on a TDM arena is way simpler than the target mode. So they make several kills with one shot. They pleased the premade fan base who is willing to confront their testosterone with the random and noob players showing his killing streaks as the only way to measure skill; they simplified a mode and thus save time and efforts because is technically better for them to set a simpler TDM than fix the current TM (and they wont even touch respawn places, etc, sadly) and they will get applause for being LAZY, basically; and at least on the begginning they will attract to the mode a lot of ppl that didnt play TM because it was somewhat difficult for the rookie, then increasing numbers to exhibit as a success in reddit or twitter.

    I don’t know... All they had to do was replace troopers with heroes in blast and set it up on its own sever playlist. Same goes for Extraction. That’s about as easy as it gets.

    The heroes in this game are exceedingly popular. There’s no good reason why we don’t have more than one hero mode. We have three small trooper modes. With only four trooper classes per faction but ten hero selections, I just can’t fathom why we only have one hero mode. It just doesn’t make sense.
  • Maliainu
    1107 posts Member
    edited May 14
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    See that’s what you target lovers don’t get. It’s the abuse of the target system and using the spawns and respawning for fresh health and abilities that we don’t like. You purposefully avoid fighting in order to win. You’ve had your way for over a year and a half now. I hope it’s amounted you many many wins. Now it’s our turn. If hero blast comes out and the runner I played against yesterday is my opponent again and he wins, then I’ll admit defeat to a superior player. I’ll take a long hard look at whether I’m even as good as I think I am. Now, hopefully, it’s us slayers’ turns to use the tactics we wanna use in blast mode if that’s what it ends up being.

    No, I do understand this point. I’m advocating to have the target system stay and adding the new system for HvV.

    I do not represent the rest who want it removed, this is my view.
  • UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    UhOhItsJus wrote: »
    I forgot to mention too (and I have video evidence to back it up) yesterday I played 3 HvV matches and in two of them there was a quitter in the other team. Both games lasted more than ten minutes without a replacement joining to fill their 4th. This was at 6PM on US east coast on Virginia servers. If there are indeed thousands upon thousands trying to play why then during a prime time hour on an extremely populated server was there not a single person found to fill the spot?

    The problem is that Dice matchmaking for this game is really bad. They have attempted to fix it once. It only improved slightly, so that people could join the same team if they were partied up. However, they haven't done anything else with it since then and it has tons of problems.


    People in here are FOOLISH if they thing changing HvV target to Hero Blast will change anything with the game mode. Hero Blast will be a huge pile of garbage still because the main two issues aren't being addressed with Target system. Those two issues are:
    1. Spawning and spawn points still spawn killed team members at opposite corners of the map. Making it hard to cross the map and rejoin the team without encountering the enemy team.
    2. Matchmaking in this game still sucks because it stacks the team typically with a lot of new people on one side and the experienced players on the other side. Give everyone a rank for each game mode based on how much they play or what rank they get overall in the game. This will be a "moving average rank" so that the last 10-20 games they played determine your overall rank. The rank is based on your overall scoreboard rank for each game. It should be a moving average of the scoreboard ranks, so that it takes into consideration how much you were doing the objective and killing enemies. All it needs to be moving average so that it adjusts with how you are playing. Scoreboard rank is a really quick and easy way to determine that without having to add more coding for determining people's rank some other way. Then in modes like HvV the game can balance the game as best as possible by ensuring that the average team rank is pretty close to each other. Or come up with something similar to this.

    The issue is that everyone thinks that the target mode itself is the problem. That is far from actuality. The real problem was when it would select the new target and the above two issues. If dice would have adjusted when it selected the target, so that 3/4 people had to be alive or wait until they were alive to do so. Then you wouldn't get a lot of these easy kills where it selected the new character

    Also any experienced team knows that while runners can be irritating, teamwork will stop a runner all the time. The game mode is quite fun and would work much better if they would have just fixed these issues.

    People keep going on and on about how every enconter will matter in Hero Blast, which is a highly laughable statement. The only encounters that will really matter are between the experienced and the new players. As the new players will die much more often and the game will boil down to whichever side has more of the new players. People will continue to leave the game because of this and I suspect that they will start leaving Hero Blast at a much higher rate than they are now in HvV because of this major imbalance issue. The final thing that people fail to realize is that the target system is there, so that new players are able to die more often than the rest of the team without completely ruining the game mode for everyone else. If the new people die more often than they are less likely to be the target and the more experienced players will become the target.
    People like you always defend the target system but it boils down to the same thing with different wordage. You are advocating for participation trophies. It stands within perfect reason that if team A is good experienced players and team B has new low skill gamers then of course team A will win and they should. If team B are bad players and they can win it means one of two things, either team B isn’t actually bad players, or the game design is flawed that gives wins to players that it shouldn’t.

    Every single argument I’ve seen that wants to keep the target system 100% advocates for wins for low skill gamers that would lose in a straight up team deathmatch

    You are wrong. Truth is, you may not have ever been more wrong in you life.

    I’ll preface this by saying that those who use wall glitches to hide should all burn in... Well you get the idea.

    If your “perfect reason” description were actually true, the world would be a completely different place. This is basic combat tactics 101. When confronted with a superior force, be it numbers, or for our purposes skill, the lesser force must employ alternative tactics to win. The superior force will not, nor should not always win. Speed and maneuverability, and the breaking of the accepted(or in our case, desired) rules of engagement.

    It’s been said that a runner allows the remaining three on his team to slowly whittle down a superior team and get the point. This is true. It’s incumbent on the superior(more powerful) team to adapt to this tactic or be defeated. Calling this cowardly is a lazy excuse for getting defeated by choices instead of thumbs on controllers.

    Here are some real world historical examples.

    - Without the application of cowardly tactics, the United States would never have beaten the British in the Revolutionary War. Had they not learned to not just line up on the battlefield, and instead employ hit and run tactics when necessary, we would have lost. We almost learned too late. The British called them cowards for fighting this way. Washington crossed the Potomac River in the dead of winter to take the enemy by surprise. He was breaking the standard rules of engagement and using the terrain to his advantage. The British branded him cowardly... among other things.

    -At the Thrilla in Manila, Muhammed Ali ran from George Foreman for over three quarters of the match. Straight up ran... in boxing terms. He used the ropes(terrain) to his advantage with speed and maneuvering while conserving stamina. George, a beast of a man in his prime, should have won but was tired-out and psychology frustrated by this tactic. This was Ali in his thirties, after being out of boxing for several years. He was the inferior force of the two. It was termed rope-a-dope. No one called him a coward though, but he was credited with superior tactics. The Sweet Science.

    -Long ago 300 Spartans stood against Xerxes and a Persian army that they claim was a million strong. They used the mountain pass named Thermopylae to render the Persian numbers meaningless. They used terrain in such a fashion that some would call a it map exploit. (This is not the same as wall glitches. There are no terrain glitches in the real world) But it is the same as many things players in this game do that inconveniences opponents of superior skill. Unlike the British, the Persians adapted. They used another mountain pass to get behind the Spartans.

    -The Mujahideen Afghans vs the Russians in the 80’s.
    -The Viet-Cong vs the US.
    -General Patton vs Rommel in WWII.

    I could go on endlessly but you get the idea. These lesser forces were able to accomplish much more than they should have been able to because of tactics which were designed to thwart a superior force.

    They were all called cowards by the defeated.

    A superior force should win, but victory is, always has been, and always will be more than just who has the most power(skill).

    Now, I understand that a different ruleset would change the way matches would play. I also understand that some folks would appreciate a more basic playing field where the fella who’d win in a 1v1 through simple twitch reflexes would also translate into a 4v4. TDM will go along way towards that. Just don’t think for one second that the target system is intrinsically flawed because a lesser force can upset a greater one. That mentality has been the downfall of many more powerful(skilled) forces since the beginning of combat.

    The target system is almost gone. Whatever we get, don’t be surprised if some meta tactic arises for a lesser group to defeat a greater one. And this time around, adjust your own strategy before trying to change the rules again.
    I stopped reading less than halfway thru. Here’s is the biggest flaw and your very own defeat. You only equate “more skilled gamers” to being superior with the use of a controller. Yes having quick reaction time and high dexterity does allow a skilled player to emerge. But that’s not the only thing that makes players skilled. Wits, tactics, planning, positioning all contribute to a dominant players arsenal. Think of it like madden. You have a quarterback with 99 speed, wow that’s fast. But his throw accuracy and power are rated at 50. His overall rating would be idk let’s say 60. Now take another quarterback his speed is only 70 but his throw accuracy and power is 70. That makes him rated a 70 overall and the better quarterback. I mean it can get deeper too like depending on how the coaches use said QBs can determine the fate of the game but you get he picture.
    Of course you stopped reading, who would have expected otherwise.

    Your bolded sentence above is a reiteration of my entire post. Thank you for the public acknowledgment.

    I’ve played Madden since it began in 1988. I played it heavily for about 20 years. I’ve won more madden games than you, and everyone that you know, have even played. Thank you for bringing that game here for analogy purposes.
    An accurate passer will stay in the pocket and throw. A less accurate passer with a high speed will... wait for it.... run. Thank you again.
    See that’s what you target lovers don’t get. It’s the abuse of the target system and using the spawns and respawning for fresh health and abilities that we don’t like. You purposefully avoid fighting in order to win. You’ve had your way for over a year and a half now. I hope it’s amounted you many many wins. Now it’s our turn. If hero blast comes out and the runner I played against yesterday is my opponent again and he wins, then I’ll admit defeat to a superior player. I’ll take a long hard look at whether I’m even as good as I think I am. Now, hopefully, it’s us slayers’ turns to use the tactics we wanna use in blast mode if that’s what it ends up being.
    You are quite the gem. I appreciate all that you are doing here. You cannot abuse the target system by utilizing speed and maneuverability. That’s analogous to saying your abusing the passing system by using play actions and read options.

    My defeat? What an interesting sentiment. Though I suspect without even realizing it, you have already conceded. By expanding your premise to now include spawning and respawning exploits, you are admitting that your original position doesn’t stand on it’s own. This is also analogous to repositioning. Again, gratitude for the validation.

    Respawning to avoid death and reset abilities is cheating. Just like wall glitches.

    Then you actually state this,
    “You’ve had your way for over a year and a half now. I hope it’s amounted you many many wins. Now it’s our turn.”
    The...”It’s my turn, it’s my turn” argument? That’s embarrassing I it’s own right without my help. Suffice to say that the child in you has emerged.

    Lastly, take it easy on yourself. No long hard looks necessary. Your going to win some and lose some. We all do.
    You’re taking a figurative statement and making it literal. Good job on not actually making any concise statement whatsoever. You don’t seem to comprehend the current issue being addressed in this thread whatsoever. Here’s the low down; players can’t get a kill (by tactics or superior controller ability) so they run continually and avoid all fighting. Teammates spawn in with full health and fresh abilities over and over and each time take away hmm let’s say 50 health each life. Rinse and repeat until the enemy target is dead. Not by any type of tactic related to combat. The simple “tactic” (as you call it) of oh I have infinite lives and they mean nothing in the scope of this game mode so let me just run straight in and cause damage until I die and spawn in again is used. I never called respawn and spawning it’s own exploit. It’s part of a runners “strategy” to use the infitinte lives of 0 value and poor spawns to whittle down the opponent targets life.

    And no, I didn’t describe what your post stated. Again, your narrow mind only equates a skillful player to being experienced with a controller. It’s much more than that. Superior is not exactly equal to “larger” or “more populated” in your examples that I have now read and tried to see how they relate to this video game (it’s funny you relate a video game with infinite lives of no value to real world revolutions but yet laugh at my relation of this video game to another video game in an attempt to get you to understand a rating system 😅 who is the real child?) the superior force was not the one greatest in numbers. They were more efficient point blank period. That’s why they won. And running away constantly so your teammates can spawn in 35 times is not efficient in any sense of the terms. And yes now it’s our turn the target system is going away. Complain all you want, it might come back in 18 months. You may try to attack me all you want, at the end of the day you’ll no longer be target and the more you run the more you lose so have fun kiddo
  • AzorAhai wrote: »
    Just have two different modes. It's an easy solution.

    Runners and those that aren't sensitive to encountering runners will have what they want, and those who get frustrated by runners will have what they want.

    If this game can't survive the addition of another mode, then all this arguing is in jest, isn't it? (We're doomed)

    Having said that, I'm hoping the reworked HvV will be 6v6!
    What about team deathmatch with a target that gives two points if you kill him
  • This whole time it’s been nice seeing Jus try and be a voice of reasoning. Bro you run around with an officer and drop a turret the second you get hit. I watched a couple You Tube videos today while I was eating and why do I see you and your “crew” just stream sniping😂😂😂😂 complaining about exploits when y’all abuse many in GA 😂😂😂😂 please log off, there’s levels to this stuff 😉

    People "exploit" the cave's in Ewok Hunt. What the hell does that have to do with the target system? Please log off until you figure out what your point is...

    Just find it ironic people crusade for things they enjoy doing hahaha. But I said what I said about Jussie no need to rehash, but buddy, you just compared GA to Ewok Hunt. I didn’t even know Ewok Hunt was still in this game....
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