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My concern with the new hero health system

Landeaux
3467 posts Member
edited October 2017
Yes, I know. I promised I wouldn't return to the forums until the beta ended but I wanted to make a quick point before disappearing for the weekend and returning Sunday night to make my final judgement on the beta.

The new hero health system is devastating to heroes. When the pre-alpha showed off the "new" hero health system where heroes would have less health than heroes from the last game but would have the ability to fully regenerate that health over time, I felt as if that was a reasonable change. I had strongly defended this change as being a "fair tradeoff" because, though heroes did less single-ability and single-hit damage to infantry and had less health, all you had to do was survive with at least 1 healthpoint then you would be able to heal up over time. I found this to be a healthy change. Well the new beta hero health system has made me look like an absolute fool for previously defending the changes to the health system. I had attributed heroes doing less overall damage and having less health to the fact that they could fully regenerate their health so it would not matter in the end. This is not the case anymore. I still stand by the fact that no hero should start out with less than 600 maximum health. DICE have come out and said that they changed the health system because they didn't want infantry to feel as though their damage on heroes didn't surmount to anything in the end. This new system gives infantry a "moral victory." It doesn't matter if they didn't kill the hero as long as they did damage to them. This is falling right back into the problems with the hero system in the last game. People will get so low on health that they decide to be passive. They will become too scared to fight or even defend their teammates. This new hero system reinforces the lack of respect that heroes now have. Infantry dont fear heroes anymore. Let me be clear, it should never feel like you stand no chance against a hero but there is a major difference between a hero being balanced and a hero being underpowered. In theory, a hero can take enough damage to have their max health reduced to around 300. A Super Battle Droid or a Wookie Warrior, on the other hand, can have 400 health at that very same time. What sense does it make for a hero's max health to ever be less than the max health of any other reinforcement? What's the point of spending 2,000 extra BattlePoints if I could've saved those points and gotten the heavy reinforcement. I would be close-but-not-quite as effective as a hero damage wise but I can fully regenerate my health back to 400! Let heroes be heroes. Yes, this game is mostly about infantry but Star Wars wouldnt be Star Wars without heroes. Don't do them a disservice by making them underwhelming. One thing I do while playing Rey is I get into the hallway during the first phase in the Palace and I stand in front of and block for my teammates so they can return fire; I am now discouraged in doing so because someone can throw a grenade or shoot me with a StarCard shotgun and I will lose max health for being a team player. I'm not sure if there is a specific algorithm that goes into decreasing a hero's max health when sustaining x damage but the minimum max health of a hero that has had his/her healthbar decreased due to taking sufficient damage should never be less than the maximum health of any other reinforcement. Please, DICE, restore respect and effectiveness into heroes.

Replies

  • Heroes are still very effective. Don't put yourself in a situation you can't get yourself out of with decent health. I like it the way it is
  • You're a hero. They are infantry. Th hey should be in front of you protecting the heroes. That's smart team play lol
  • Shinjuku
    1760 posts Member
    edited October 2017
                

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  • Salty_SeaDawg
    61 posts Member
    edited October 2017
    I kind of agree. Heros health is perfect atm, but I think you should be able to heal back to full health if you get damaged down to 1hp and escape. Maybe after 5 minutes (if you survive that long) then the hero gets fatigued, and you then lose the ability to regenerate to full after taking big damage (exactly like it is now)

    Also... Paragraphs save lives
  • Evazan127
    8105 posts Member
    edited October 2017
    No hero health system is perfect or even great for that matter. I’ve accepted that and the hero health system is fine.

    But, a buff to heros is definitely possible before launch
  • Janas
    47 posts Member
    I actually think everything is just about fine if they went ahead and added full hero health regen as is. It's funny, because people certainly complained that they were OP in BF2015 (and they absolutely were), and now that they're taken down to a level that's just a certain few steps above infantry, they're speaking as if they're too weak. I'm sorry, but that system to me is just objectively better. It doesn't really make sense for Han Solo to take sixty blaster bolts to the face. But I agree that every Battle-Point paid asset, (aside from temporary time in heavy vehicles like the LAAT and AT-AT), should be able to regen to full health, because of their newfound vulnerability.

    I like frequent heroes, strong ones but also vulnerable ones. In general, this was a great move. But I do think full regen should be the way to go.
  • Shinjuku
    1760 posts Member
    Janas wrote: »
    I actually think everything is just about fine if they went ahead and added full hero health regen as is. It's funny, because people certainly complained that they were OP in BF2015 (and they absolutely were), and now that they're taken down to a level that's just a certain few steps above infantry, they're speaking as if they're too weak. I'm sorry, but that system to me is just objectively better. It doesn't really make sense for Han Solo to take sixty blaster bolts to the face. But I agree that every Battle-Point paid asset, (aside from temporary time in heavy vehicles like the LAAT and AT-AT), should be able to regen to full health, because of their newfound vulnerability.

    I like frequent heroes, strong ones but also vulnerable ones. In general, this was a great move. But I do think full regen should be the way to go.

    The pre-alpha hero health system is what they need to revert back to, so yes I agree full health regeneration needs to be put into effect. I personally never had any issues with the heroes in SWBF15. All you needed was the right star card setup and you could shred the heroes plus it was fun and daring to keep going head to head with them, it felt like a great sense of achievement when you'd drop one of them IMO.
    MLtmeEi.png
    " If you're not with me, then you're my enemy."
  • Full regen is the way to go
  • I think that it's alright it just makes the hero be used more carefully/tactfully. Personally I liked the full Regen but maybe they will change it back. Also as far as changes, #MakeOfficerGreatAgain. The self heal and extra points was awesome!
  • I've been losing as the separatists because 2 people pick Boba and maul, lose most of their health immediately , then hang out in the back, killing the odd clone trooper. Just like what people liked to do in the first game.
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  • The only people that are concerned about the new health system are those who would most likely camp the entire match with a hero, keeping the slot constantly filled. I like the new system, I hope they don't change it.
  • Heroes are still very effective. Don't put yourself in a situation you can't get yourself out of with decent health. I like it the way it is

    They're effective in a very non traditional and asinine way though. Each kill is like trying to solve a puzzle. You gotta jump around and wait until there aren't very many people looking in your direction and just really annoying things.

    In uncharted 3 the g-mal was meant to be a mid/long ranged weapon. But you could dominate people by jumping and hitting the fire button at close ranges. This would cause your weapon's blind fire to auto lock on and get you out of nasty situations. It was completely unintentional by the devs and did serve the purpose of being effective in close ranges.... but I mean is that really how the gun should behave?

    Yeah with maul I can hide around corners and wait for people to walk by or whatever but it just doesn't seem like such a practical use for a character like that.

    in the last one no one picked vader and then hid behind a rock by the objective and poked their head out to throw their saber every time it was on cooldown just for the sake of being "efficient" on the battlefield like you have to do now. You went out and you did darth vader type *****.

    All the heroes there had their own feel and style. You played them all differently to maximize potential.

    here rey and maul both play the same. yeah they have different abilities but you stand behind a wall until one guy gets close and whack him around with your glowy stick until he dies. Then you proceed to hide and do the whole thing over if you're...."smart"

    Heroes should lead the battlefield, not hide in nooks and crannies hoping your teammates take out that nasty 2000 point jump pack trooper.
    Janas wrote: »
    I actually think everything is just about fine if they went ahead and added full hero health regen as is. It's funny, because people certainly complained that they were OP in BF2015 (and they absolutely were), and now that they're taken down to a level that's just a certain few steps above infantry, they're speaking as if they're too weak. I'm sorry, but that system to me is just objectively better. It doesn't really make sense for Han Solo to take sixty blaster bolts to the face. But I agree that every Battle-Point paid asset, (aside from temporary time in heavy vehicles like the LAAT and AT-AT), should be able to regen to full health, because of their newfound vulnerability.

    I like frequent heroes, strong ones but also vulnerable ones. In general, this was a great move. But I do think full regen should be the way to go.

    The blaster heroes were OP. No one's ever said "I got over 100 kills with luke or vader or the emperor" they got over 100 kills with a dude who can shoot cross map and hide behind a rock.

    melee and ranged heroes should be treated differently. I can't sit back and snipe people with my saber as maul or rey. You have to get into the action and when you get close stuff gets nasty. But with boba you can literally stand as far back as you want and use both your rocket abilities, hide, do some pot shots, then come out with your rocket abilities again.

    It's not really fair when people can abuse bossk and get a billion kills because of poor BLASTER HERO balance, have all heroes nerfed and then have people like the emperor sitting in a corner crying because some d-bag chose a ranged character with a super gun and abused the heck out of it.
    I've been losing as the separatists because 2 people pick Boba and maul, lose most of their health immediately , then hang out in the back, killing the odd clone trooper. Just like what people liked to do in the first game.

    Yeah, such a low health system and the actual ability to choose when you want to be a hero only encourage absolute asinine forms of play.
    The only people that are concerned about the new health system are those who would most likely camp the entire match with a hero, keeping the slot constantly filled. I like the new system, I hope they don't change it.

    I don't like the health or damage and no I wouldn't camp if they were changed. I'd pick a saber character and do what's meant to be done. Help push the objectives. I don't think it's a terrible idea that a guy with massive AoE strokes, two ended saber, and AoE skills should be able to take out a room of 5 guys huddled together.
  • The only people that are concerned about the new health system are those who would most likely camp the entire match with a hero, keeping the slot constantly filled. I like the new system, I hope they don't change it.

    What did you think of the heroes in the previous Star Wars Battlefront 2015?
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    " If you're not with me, then you're my enemy."
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